Owen Sound Committee - Strategic Planning Ad Hoc Meeting Transcript — September 24, 2025

00:00:47 Speaker 01: Willie will call the meeting to order.

00:00:50 Speaker 01: This is the Strategic Planning Ad Hoc Committee for September 24th, 2025.

00:00:55 Speaker 01: Councillor Koepke is here.

00:00:57 Speaker 01: Councillor Koepke is unable to attend.

00:01:00 Speaker 01: Member Steve Low is unable to attend.

00:01:02 Speaker 01: So everyone else is here.

00:01:06 Speaker 01: Call for additional business.

00:01:09 Speaker 01: Seeing none.

00:01:11 Speaker 01: Confirmation of the minutes from June 18th, 2025.

00:01:16 Speaker 01: Deputy Mayor Greig.

00:01:20 Speaker 01: So moved.

00:01:22 Speaker 01: Any discussion or amendments of those needed?

00:01:25 Speaker 01: Seeing none.

00:01:26 Speaker 01: Call the question.

00:01:26 Speaker 01: Seeing none, I'll call the question.

00:01:27 Speaker 01: All in favour?

00:01:28 Speaker 01: That is carried.

00:01:31 Speaker 01: We have no deputations or presentations.

00:01:34 Speaker 01: We have at number six public forum.

00:01:37 Speaker 01: No, we're good.

00:01:39 Speaker 01: Good.

00:01:40 Speaker 01: Number seven, we have no correspondence items presented for council's consideration.

00:01:46 Speaker 01: Though I think you probably did get an email last night.

00:01:50 Speaker 01: Reports from city staff.

00:01:52 Speaker 01: Over to you, Michelle.

00:01:58 Speaker 01: Go ahead.

00:01:58 Speaker 01: Hold on, Councillor Gregg, Deputy Mayor Greig.

00:02:02 Speaker 02: I just would say I'm glad to move the recommendation and put it on the floor for you, Mayor Byer.

00:02:19 Speaker 02: Oh.

00:02:23 Speaker 03: See your bare body, no problem.

00:02:25 Speaker 03: I'm battling a head cold, and I wasn't sure if that was me or you at that point.

00:02:31 Speaker 03: I'm here to present Report CM 25-029, which is review of the final draft of Future On Sound Vision 2050 Long Term Strategic Plan.

00:02:41 Speaker 03: As noted within the report, over the past 22 months, this committee has provided valuable support to this initiative by providing feedback on the engagement plan, facilitating community conversations, encouraging participation in the community survey,

00:02:55 Speaker 03: meeting with various stakeholder audiences, and participating in the seven visioning sessions.

00:02:59 Speaker 03: And this support has really helped ensure that the Future On Sound 2050 vision long-term strategic plan reflects the community's priorities.

00:03:08 Speaker 03: At the June 25th meeting, the committee provided feedback on the consultant's report and identified the following opportunities: that inclusion of metrics into the document would ensure that the city is measuring progress;

00:03:20 Speaker 03: that metrics need to be outcome-based versus activity-based, and inclusion of actions in an aspirational document caused some confusion,

00:03:27 Speaker 03: as the long-term strategic plan is intended to serve as a guiding compass rather than a detailed roadmap.

00:03:34 Speaker 03: Based on that feedback, staff have made the following two changes to the document: the removal of the detailed action and the inclusion of metrics.

00:03:43 Speaker 03: The actions, which were always intended, will move into the organisational work plans, so the actions are not lost; they still remain.

00:03:51 Speaker 03: They just get presented in the work plan going forward.

00:03:55 Speaker 03: Over the past few months, staff researched potential quantitative metrics with a focus on identifying metrics that are statistically relevant, have readily accessible data specific to the Owen Sound community,

00:04:06 Speaker 03: and can effectively assess the outcomes of each priority.

00:04:10 Speaker 03: Attachment two to the report offers a summary of the metrics for each priority, as well as the data sources, historical trends, and rationale.

00:04:17 Speaker 03: These metrics establish clear targets, enabling regular assessments and accountability in the progress we make as we move towards the will be statements for the priorities.

00:04:28 Speaker 03: Going forward, an annual organisational work plan will encompass the specific actions as well as other projects and initiatives alongside core services, ensuring the strategic priorities are effectively pursued.

00:04:41 Speaker 03: An annual comprehensive report on actions implemented in alignment with the priorities will be presented to council each year, and I'm happy to take any questions at this time.

00:04:52 Speaker 03: Thank you.

00:04:54 Speaker 03: Committee, questions?

00:04:56 Speaker 03: Got the document there?

00:04:58 Speaker 03: Got the priorities there?

00:04:59 Speaker 02: Go ahead.

00:05:00 Speaker 02: I just say, Michelle, I thought the document was really really good.

00:05:06 Speaker 02: Returning it back to council, super supportive of it, and one of the outcomes of reading it, I thought the city manager in the Manager,

00:05:14 Speaker 02: the current city manager may wish to be here for 20 years.

00:05:17 Speaker 02: I don't know; that's perhaps his decision.

00:05:19 Speaker 02: But in reviewing it, I saw it as a document that you know, on a recurring over ten years or however long the city wanted to hold the document.

00:05:33 Speaker 02: It's something that could almost be utilised in the recruitment process.

00:05:37 Speaker 02: It's an open document that would sit there really well, enabling possible future CAOs or administrative leaders to be able to draw upon that and contribute.

00:05:51 Speaker 02: Okay, how am I going to impact?

00:05:53 Speaker 02: How am I going to work with the community?

00:05:55 Speaker 02: How am I going to build the community and so forth?

00:05:57 Speaker 02: So, I just thought it was you know quite multifaceted in terms of how it just spoke to me at the finish.

00:06:03 Speaker 02: So, very glad with what you came forward with.

00:06:06 Speaker 02: Thanks.

00:06:08 Speaker 02: Others?

00:06:09 Speaker 02: Anyone?

00:06:10 Speaker 02: Nope.

00:06:10 Speaker 02: Go ahead.

00:06:12 Speaker 04: Through you, Mr. Mayor, I'll just echo Deputy Mayor Scott Greig's comment.

00:06:18 Speaker 04: Thank you, Michelle, for putting in the feedback from the last meeting.

00:06:21 Speaker 04: And I think, when I read the report, most of the action items were crystal clear.

00:06:26 Speaker 04: And thank you for the amazing work.

00:06:27 Speaker 04: It truly encompasses and incorporates all the valuable feedback from the community, as well as the discussion that happened within this committee.

00:06:36 Speaker 04: Thank you.

00:06:37 Speaker 04: So I'm fully supportive of this.

00:06:41 Speaker 04: Yep.

00:06:41 Speaker 04: Go ahead.

00:06:42 Speaker 04: Also, thank you, Michelle.

00:06:47 Speaker 04: I perhaps am somebody who's maybe more attached to the actual viable action portion.

00:06:55 Speaker 05: So I appreciate the explanation that all of the actions that we saw in the first iteration are going to be present in the work plan,

00:07:02 Speaker 05: in addition to more things that are objectively measurable in terms of their realization.

00:07:13 Speaker 05: I suppose what I do want to sort of ensure is that, like going forward, that the communication to the public is on point because I think people are pretty thirsty for real, tangible deliverables.

00:07:30 Speaker 05: And you know, I said this I think at the beginning of our time here.

00:07:36 Speaker 05: City has here, city hasn't always been super fantastic at relaying the you know easy to digest tidbits out to the public, and I think that's going to be a super important piece.

00:07:50 Speaker 05: I mean, we learned so much from this process around how to engage, and certainly everyone's given their feedback, and leveling up on the communication, I think,

00:08:02 Speaker 05: is going to be such a huge part of going forward.

00:08:11 Speaker 06: No, go ahead, Clark.

00:08:12 Speaker 06: I was going to go in a different direction, but go ahead.

00:08:16 Speaker 06: Thank you, through you, Your Worship.

00:08:19 Speaker 06: I think it's a tremendous improvement on the last iteration, and again, thank you for incorporating all that feedback.

00:08:31 Speaker 06: And I think it is very digestible.

00:08:34 Speaker 06: I like the format.

00:08:35 Speaker 06: I think it's easy to read, and it is sort of a manageable length as well.

00:08:41 Speaker 06: So in terms of you know, getting the people can flip to what interests them and get the information fairly quickly.

00:08:50 Speaker 06: I did have some comments as well.

00:08:53 Speaker 06: Is this the time or yeah okay, so I did notice that a good number nine out of the sixteen metrics were based on satisfaction surveys, so I have some concerns about that.

00:09:07 Speaker 06: Like, how are the surveys crafted?

00:09:09 Speaker 06: Surveys can be very tricky things.

00:09:13 Speaker 06: They're not necessarily consistent over time.

00:09:15 Speaker 06: They're different people answering them.

00:09:17 Speaker 07: So, I was a little concerned about the reliance on satisfaction surveys, and would like a little more information on that.

00:09:26 Speaker 07: I wonder if with that we could add some more objective measures as well that could be added.

00:09:39 Speaker 07: Also, maybe tightening up.

00:09:41 Speaker 07: There's one Prosper City net increase in the number of businesses by 50 with every census cycle, but it is noted that we're focusing in on tech specifically.

00:09:54 Speaker 07: So I wondered if we wanted to say, you know, a portion of that is tech, so that the metric helps drive that objective as well.

00:10:04 Speaker 07: So, so that's.

00:10:06 Speaker 07: Do you want me to go through?

00:10:10 Speaker 07: Sure.

00:10:10 Speaker 07: You can.

00:10:11 Speaker 07: We go.

00:10:11 Speaker 07: Might be easier that way.

00:10:12 Speaker 07: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:10:22 Speaker 07: Three Mirbody.

00:10:23 Speaker 03: Thank you, Member McFarland.

00:10:25 Speaker 03: So, the reliance on the satisfaction surveys.

00:10:29 Speaker 03: One of the things when we started investigating potential metrics is the difficulty in finding reliable, available data that is statistically relevant to the City of Owen Sound.

00:10:41 Speaker 03: So, a really great example of that, for example, is the Great Bruce labour market information.

00:10:46 Speaker 03: That would be a great data source for us.

00:10:48 Speaker 03: It's readily available, but they don't narrow it down to the Owen Sound community to break out that part.

00:10:54 Speaker 03: So we can't use that.

00:10:56 Speaker 03: So when we looked at hundreds and hundreds of potential data sources, we really focused on three main things.

00:11:05 Speaker 03: One is it outcome specific, so not is it an action.

00:11:10 Speaker 03: Did we complete this action?

00:11:11 Speaker 03: Yes or no. But really, are we moving the metric on the long term goal?

00:11:14 Speaker 03: Two is it statistically reliable, and three is it readily available because we don't have staffing that can dedicate to metric calculation.

00:11:25 Speaker 03: The citizen satisfaction survey.

00:11:27 Speaker 03: I'll start to speak to it, and the city manager may want to jump in on this one.

00:11:30 Speaker 03: We hire a firm that does statisticians, and I'm not a mathematician by any stretch of the imagination.

00:11:37 Speaker 03: So please bear with me in my layman's version of how this works.

00:11:41 Speaker 03: But they develop a survey, and it is within three point six percent accuracy rate, and it is done based on our population segment,

00:11:56 Speaker 03: so it is statistically reliable to our population of what those results are.

00:12:02 Speaker 03: We've only done one citizen satisfaction.

00:12:04 Speaker 03: That was in 2021.

00:12:05 Speaker 03: That was our very first one.

00:12:07 Speaker 03: Our next one is scheduled for 2027, I believe now.

00:12:12 Speaker 03: In order that we have some time with the vision in place to sort of begin to see if the metrics have moved.

00:12:19 Speaker 03: So I would say, at first glance, I think some people may think, "Well, we're that's a subjective metric, but it's actually not.

00:12:26 Speaker 03: It's an objective metric that's statistically reliable."

00:12:29 Speaker 03: In terms of the increase in business, I don't think it's specific to tech.

00:12:35 Speaker 03: I think our will be statement encompasses tech as one commercial population, but I don't think it's specific to that.

00:12:43 Speaker 03: And the other problem we have is pulling out data that would be specific to each type.

00:12:49 Speaker 03: So when we can use this census data, we can pull out the number of businesses overall in a statistically reliable way.

00:12:59 Speaker 07: Thank you for that.

00:13:00 Speaker 07: I just a follow-up question, just for my own clarity for the satisfaction survey.

00:13:07 Speaker 07: So they do it by population.

00:13:09 Speaker 07: Do they also do it by demographic?

00:13:12 Speaker 07: And so we're getting a cross section of our community as opposed to simple basic number.

00:13:22 Speaker 07: Do you remember, body?

00:13:22 Speaker 03: Correct.

00:13:23 Speaker 03: Sorry, that was the word I was struggling to find and couldn't find.

00:13:25 Speaker 03: It's by demo.

00:13:27 Speaker 03: It's weighted to the demographics.

00:13:28 Speaker 03: So when they do the survey, they actually will keep going until they have answers enough that it's reflective of our demographics within the population.

00:13:40 Speaker 03: Just again follow up.

00:13:42 Speaker 03: So the tech piece.

00:13:45 Speaker 03: It's in on page six.

00:13:47 Speaker 07: It does say particularly in future-focused sectors such as tech and sustainability, technology and sustainability.

00:13:55 Speaker 07: So, I mean, we do have.

00:13:58 Speaker 07: It's not the be-all and end-all, but it is particular, and it's significant enough that we're putting it in the text.

00:14:05 Speaker 07: So, I just think that we could strengthen this, not replace it, but strengthen it by giving some mention of you know of those fifty, maybe three are tech or something,

00:14:20 Speaker 07: because the metrics really support the actions.

00:14:23 Speaker 07: We look at the metrics and say, how do we achieve this?

00:14:26 Speaker 07: Well, if we have tech in the text and we have tech in the metrics, then we're going to pursue and do things for tech as well.

00:14:33 Speaker 07: So I think it supports the effort and improves the metric.

00:14:38 Speaker 07: Is Jesper's point?

00:14:42 Speaker 07: So sorry.

00:14:44 Speaker 03: Seeing Mayor Boddy, I'm happy to take that back and have another go through the census data to see if we can parse that out.

00:14:50 Speaker 03: I don't think we can, if I recall correctly, at this moment.

00:14:54 Speaker 03: But I'm happy to take that back and have another look.

00:14:58 Speaker 01: If I can just jump in there, I do know.

00:15:01 Speaker 01: Notice on the attachment, number two, being the metrics that talks about industry, commercial, institutional, and doesn't get specific into text on the actual on the actual metrics.

00:15:13 Speaker 01: including data source, baseline rationale.

00:15:19 Speaker 07: Yes, thanks.

00:15:20 Speaker 07: I have a few.

00:15:20 Speaker 07: Just in city building, it's just trying to align the metrics with some of the text.

00:15:29 Speaker 07: And there is, there is in the quote we use and the text quote is: "there's, I think, sort of an affordability piece there," and then there's accessible and responsive to evolving requirements, community stakeholders, investors.

00:15:47 Speaker 07: Also, so is there an affordability metric we can add to this as well?

00:15:54 Speaker 07: Was that considered?

00:16:03 Speaker 03: Through your member body, the issue is the data sources.

00:16:09 Speaker 03: It comes back to the data source and being able to have a reliable, statistically relevant data source.

00:16:17 Speaker 03: I have not been able to find one that could parse out Owen Sound in that way.

00:16:23 Speaker 03: So at this point, I would say there's not.

00:16:25 Speaker 03: But again, I'm happy to take that back and look.

00:16:31 Speaker 03: Thank you.

00:16:32 Speaker 03: I'm not trying to make your life difficult.

00:16:33 Speaker 03: We appreciate Mark.

00:16:37 Speaker 03: So the next one: Safe City.

00:16:43 Speaker 07: Well, this one.

00:16:47 Speaker 07: The few off-the-cuff thoughts were objective measures we could use for this, because this one I think it's all satisfaction surveys.

00:17:00 Speaker 07: I wonder if reduction in homelessness there is the by-names list at the county level.

00:17:10 Speaker 07: I wonder if that could be used as well as an addition to this number of overdoses that's tracked pretty regularly as well.

00:17:25 Speaker 07: So that's... and maybe I just have one last one: Fostering mutually beneficial, respectful relationships.

00:17:32 Speaker 07: And this again is more of an idea than anything, and a question.

00:17:39 Speaker 07: But I think we have seen that we've had a bit of an issue of civility in discourse, and I wonder if there's any measure of that,

00:17:53 Speaker 07: because I think there's room for improving the civility of discourse in the community.

00:18:03 Speaker 07: But again, I don't want to...

00:18:05 Speaker 07: This is not saying we have to.

00:18:07 Speaker 07: I'm just...

00:18:07 Speaker 07: I'm just...

00:18:07 Speaker 07: It's a question and exploration.

00:18:10 Speaker 07: So, and I'm happy to look into it and give you some ideas too.

00:18:15 Speaker 08: Tim, thank you, Mayor, and to Carly, a pretty great, good comments.

00:18:22 Speaker 08: And we'll, as Michelle had been speaking, we'll take those comments and look to see if there's any.

00:18:28 Speaker 08: And I just reiterate Michelle's point: Not as this may sound excuse-oriented, but it's really not.

00:18:34 Speaker 08: As we...

00:18:34 Speaker 08: I don't know how many hours we put into looking at metrics, and we kept merging metrics and actions, and actions and metrics.

00:18:41 Speaker 08: And what are we trying to do with this?

00:18:43 Speaker 08: And the metric was okay.

00:18:45 Speaker 08: Back to whether it's citizen satisfaction or census or a walkability score, something that will essentially be concrete, and we know won't move and can't be changed.

00:18:55 Speaker 08: Like if the census says it's this, we know... you know, staff, the public, the community go: "Nope."

00:19:02 Speaker 08: That's the actual piece of data we're using, and it's not sort of twisted to meet somebody else's goal.

00:19:07 Speaker 08: Like, "Oh, look at how great we are, because we've readapted something."

00:19:13 Speaker 08: But things like that, we actually spoke about things to that nature.

00:19:17 Speaker 08: You know, discourse and social media aspects and the positivity or negativity of comments online,

00:19:24 Speaker 08: and we were not able to find at the time something that pinpointed whether it was through large companies like Ogilvy and Mather in the U.S. that start to do some initial studies and research using

00:19:37 Speaker 08: companies—actually,

00:19:37 Speaker 08: the same companies we use for our citizen satisfaction survey firm research, which is an international firm.

00:19:44 Speaker 08: But again,

00:19:45 Speaker 08: we felt as though a lot of those pieces of research were set and identified for very specific lists of questions that didn't necessarily meet ours without us going into it and then developing our own

00:19:59 Speaker 08: survey with Forum Research or something else.

00:20:01 Speaker 08: So, again, I think they're all good comments, and part of this could have an organic aspect.

00:20:07 Speaker 08: So we'll have set metrics, but I think it's important for the committee to understand back to Jen what you had mentioned about the work plans and other strategies coming forward.

00:20:18 Speaker 08: So, for instance, in October we have our Investment Attraction Plan coming forward to Community Services, which is going to be focused on community engagement, investment attraction, but government relations.

00:20:32 Speaker 08: But the Investment Attraction is going to speak heavily to our technology, our green energy, and that higher level.

00:20:39 Speaker 08: And then in addition to that, we'll be having staff looking at more of a refined process for our River District businesses, which is a different type of economic development with Main Street,

00:20:49 Speaker 08: completely different than the great news story yesterday that was published and a report came forward on the hydrogen peaking plant because Hydrogen Optimize being here.

00:20:59 Speaker 08: So we have something fantastic going on, but that's a high-level economic development, so to speak, or this type of economic development.

00:21:06 Speaker 08: Sorry, I used "this type," and then there's "that type."

00:21:09 Speaker 08: They're both incredibly important, but just different mandates and different focuses.

00:21:13 Speaker 08: So, I think again, from my perspective, to the committee, it's watching those action plans.

00:21:19 Speaker 08: This is how the City needs to organise now, and I think that's the important part of having this vision that the Mayor has been advocating for for ten-plus years, I think,

00:21:30 Speaker 08: and getting to this stage.

00:21:31 Speaker 08: But it's having that solid foundation for organisation.

00:21:37 Speaker 08: We'll be looking at even our committee structures and other things of how we organise to get out of—maybe excuse me—but out of the silos of: "Hey, this is a department's committee."

00:21:48 Speaker 08: Well, no department works independently of every other department, and if these pillars absolutely don't work independently, these pillars require cross... you know, conversations.

00:22:00 Speaker 08: So again, it's going to be super helpful from my perspective, and I think from the organisation's perspective and our organisational ability to tackle this.

00:22:07 Speaker 08: So...

00:22:13 Speaker 09: I think Dad, I think you're the only one left out.

00:22:17 Speaker 09: Well then, had comments.

00:22:20 Speaker 09: We've had feedback.

00:22:21 Speaker 09: We've got motion, which was moved.

00:22:26 Speaker 09: The recommendation was moved.

00:22:32 Speaker 09: Oops.

00:22:34 Speaker 09: Oh yeah.

00:22:34 Speaker 09: Sure.

00:22:34 Speaker 09: Just as I'm reading: "Approve the final draft of Future on Sound 2050 Vision Long-Term Strategic Plan, including comments received at the September 24 Strategic Planning Ad Hoc Committee meeting."

00:22:47 Speaker 09: So I can call the question.

00:22:48 Speaker 09: All in favour?

00:22:50 Speaker 09: And that is carried.

00:22:52 Speaker 09: Well done.

00:22:58 Speaker 09: I hope the whole community feels that way.

00:23:05 Speaker 09: Well, let me show them.

00:23:07 Speaker 09: Some will, some won't.

00:23:08 Speaker 09: That's normal.

00:23:09 Speaker 09: Okay, so number nine, we have no matters postponed.

00:23:14 Speaker 09: Number ten, we have no motions which were previously given.

00:23:20 Speaker 09: There's no correspondence being presented for consideration.

00:23:23 Speaker 09: Discussion of additional business didn't have any notices of motion.

00:23:27 Speaker 09: Won't have any.

00:23:28 Speaker 09: So just before I get to adjournment, want to thank everybody that's participated.

00:23:32 Speaker 09: Everybody that's participated on this, and got us to this point.

00:23:38 Speaker 09: When I first came very early, we hired somebody external to do a strategic plan that we called our Future is Something Clear 2020, which was okay,

00:23:55 Speaker 09: but it didn't have any of the metrics or data sources or any of those things.

00:24:03 Speaker 09: And then Tim updated it.

00:24:07 Speaker 09: How many years ago that was?

00:24:08 Speaker 09: Everything's a blur because of COVID.

00:24:09 Speaker 09: But a few years ago, and then we started to add those metrics and start adding some of those things.

00:24:14 Speaker 09: One of the things I always thought was important was the economic development side, because you cannot pay for things if you don't have income,

00:24:23 Speaker 09: and so that becomes a cornerstone of wanting to provide better services.

00:24:27 Speaker 09: And frankly, the municipalities in the business of providing the best services that the community wants and can afford.

00:24:37 Speaker 09: This helps set the city for the next coming 10 to 25 years.

00:24:42 Speaker 09: Twenty-five years, as different councils come along and pick off portions and what they want to accomplish during their four-year mandate, and helps focus what staff does, the reports that come to council, how it's done,

00:24:57 Speaker 09: and go forward.

00:25:00 Speaker 09: So we thank you for helping us build it and set that direction.

00:25:06 Speaker 09: And you know, if another COVID hits, or who knows what hits, future councils have the ability to amend, change, redirect, change the metrics, perhaps, or the measurables,

00:25:22 Speaker 09: depending on what's happening in the world at that time.

00:25:24 Speaker 09: And I think that's pretty important.

00:25:26 Speaker 09: So again, thank you.

00:25:28 Speaker 09: With that, it's nine twenty-five.

00:25:32 Speaker 09: Please open the door.

00:25:35 Speaker 09: But that was what public forum was for.

00:25:41 Speaker 09: He's heading off.

00:25:43 Speaker 09: Oh, you know what?

00:25:43 Speaker 09: No, I'm gonna.

00:25:44 Speaker 09: Oh, we did call the vote.

00:25:45 Speaker 09: Okay, go ahead, Pat.

00:25:46 Speaker 09: I know he's got to go to another meeting to help the next recruitment of city manager or to direct a city manager for the next ten years.

00:26:07 Speaker 10: I could not support that more.

00:26:10 Speaker 10: And just as a hint to those of you who are considering running in any future elections, I think this is the document that voters are going to look to and say,

00:26:19 Speaker 10: "What are you going to do to move this ahead?"

00:26:21 Speaker 10: So thank you, Deputy Mayor.

00:26:24 Speaker 10: And I'm so glad staff was able to overcome committee members' good versus the perfect roadblock that happens.

00:26:34 Speaker 10: And I guess one other thing, if you need another metric for measuring things like attitudes towards racism, Indigenous peoples, homeless peoples, Australia has a very well-developed metric they use every year.

00:26:53 Speaker 10: It's a barometre that shows the change in citizen attitudes towards Indigenous people.

00:27:00 Speaker 10: I'll send it along with all the other stuff.

00:27:04 Speaker 10: But last, I think Tim's point that you have to have that cross-sectional, inter-institutional, all hands on deck approach, so that you don't just know about economic development or community development or housing or healthcare.

00:27:23 Speaker 10: Perfect.

00:27:24 Speaker 10: But I would go further.

00:27:25 Speaker 10: I really encourage council to adopt the model that I'm suggesting and have given you advice about where you bring together those pillars with a content expert from the community as well.

00:27:42 Speaker 10: So each of those you would have staff, you'd have representation from council, but you'd have strong community representation.

00:27:50 Speaker 10: Think about like John Pevers or somebody from Bruce Power, or Ann Ford from the hospital.

00:27:56 Speaker 10: Each of those pillars would have a content expert that you know is going to open doors that you know is going to guide you.

00:28:03 Speaker 10: That's evidence-based.

00:28:05 Speaker 10: That can rally the money you need because we can't do this.

00:28:09 Speaker 10: That's it.

00:28:11 Speaker 10: Just do it.

00:28:12 Speaker 10: Good.

00:28:12 Speaker 09: Thank you very much.

00:28:13 Speaker 09: And with that, we will adjourn.

00:28:15 Speaker 09: And thanks, everybody.

00:28:16 Speaker 09: Thank you.

00:28:17 Speaker 09: And it's now nine twenty-eight.