Owen Sound Council Meeting - Regular Meeting Transcript — July 27, 2026

00:00:19 Speaker 01: We are calling the meeting to order at five thirty.

00:00:23 Speaker 01: Council, there any additional business items?

00:00:26 Speaker 01: Councillor Farmer.

00:00:28 Speaker 01: I'll have two items of additional business.

00:00:30 Speaker 01: One about Bandit Fest, which took place downtown, and one about the Poverty Task Force's municipal candidate education series in September.

00:00:39 Speaker 02: Councillor Merton, through you, I have one item.

00:00:43 Speaker 02: It's a media release today on household food insecurity from the southwestern Ontario Public Health Units and their call to action.

00:00:52 Speaker 01: Seeing on that way, seeing on that way, I will have one matter concerning George.

00:00:58 Speaker 01: Concerning Georgian College, that I'll bring up in additional business declarations of interest.

00:01:09 Speaker 01: Nobody else.

00:01:10 Speaker 01: I have a declaration of interest by law twenty twenty six zero nine eight.

00:01:16 Speaker 01: It is item twenty one J in the agenda.

00:01:18 Speaker 01: Declare a direct pecuniary interest and declare a disqualifying interest.

00:01:23 Speaker 01: I have acted for the property owner at my law practice that's involved in.

00:01:27 Speaker 01: That.

00:01:33 Speaker 01: I think, John, you've got the you've got the minutes.

00:01:37 Speaker 01: So, confirmation of council minutes.

00:01:41 Speaker 03: Moved by myself, seconded by Deputy Mayor Greig, that the minutes of the following meetings be adopted as printed: Number one, the closed session of the regular council meeting held on May twenty-fifth, twenty twenty-six,

00:01:51 Speaker 03: and number two, the regular council meeting held on July thirteenth, two thousand and twenty-six.

00:01:57 Speaker 03: Great, thank you.

00:01:58 Speaker 03: All in favour?

00:02:00 Speaker 01: And that is carried.

00:02:01 Speaker 01: Number five.

00:02:02 Speaker 01: Motion to move council into committee of the whole.

00:02:06 Speaker 03: Moved by myself, seconded by Deputy Mayor Greig, that City Council now move into committee of the whole to consider public meetings, deputations and presentations, public forum, matters arising from correspondence, reports of city staff,

00:02:20 Speaker 03: the consent agenda, committee minutes, matters postponed, motions for which notice was previously given, and additional business.

00:02:28 Speaker 03: Good, thank you.

00:02:29 Speaker 03: All in favour?

00:02:30 Speaker 01: That is carried.

00:02:31 Speaker 01: So we are now in the committee of the whole, number six.

00:02:36 Speaker 01: We have one public meeting at six a.m., which is a zoning bylaw amendment number fifty nine, part one, plan sixty R, one two three zero eight,

00:02:48 Speaker 01: and I'll start with that's probably the address and thirty-eight Sixth Avenue West.

00:02:59 Speaker 01: So, if you're here for the public meeting, thank you for attending tonight's public meeting.

00:03:03 Speaker 01: The purpose of this meeting is to receive input from the public respecting the proposed amendment to the zoning bylaw as per section thirty-four of the Planning Act.

00:03:13 Speaker 01: In a few moments, the Manager of Planning and Heritage will present background information regarding the requested amendment.

00:03:20 Speaker 01: Following the presentation, we will hear from the applicant, and then we will open the floor for comments, questions, and feedback from the public.

00:03:30 Speaker 01: Every person who attends a statutory public meeting required under the Planning Act will be given an opportunity to make representations respecting the proposed bylaw.

00:03:40 Speaker 01: All submission materials for this application are available at the city's website or at the Planning Division counter at City Hall during regular business hours.

00:03:51 Speaker 01: Appeal rights on a zoning bylaw amendment application are limited to the applicant, public bodies, and specified persons who made oral or written submissions to Owen Sound City Council prior to the decision being made.

00:04:07 Speaker 01: Specific persons generally include energy, railway, and telecommunications providers.

00:04:13 Speaker 01: This meeting is an essential part of the decision-making process.

00:04:16 Speaker 01: Feedback making process feedback received will be considered in the decision of Oceanside City Council.

00:04:22 Speaker 01: An explanation of how the public and agency comments factored into the decision will be included in the notice of passing of the bylaw.

00:04:33 Speaker 01: Where changes made in a proposed bylaw after the holding of the public meeting, council will determine whether any further notices to be given respecting the proposed bylaw,

00:04:43 Speaker 01: and the determination of council as to the giving of further notice is final, not subject to review in any court, no matter the extent of the change made in the proposed bylaw.

00:04:58 Speaker 01: So, with that, I think I handed over to Ms. Bloomfield.

00:05:03 Speaker 04: Thank you, through your worship.

00:05:05 Speaker 04: Notice of this public meeting was circulated to the prescribed persons and bodies, sent by mail to the assessed owners within 120 metres of the subject properties,

00:05:14 Speaker 04: and posted on the city's website and the subject properties on July 2nd.

00:05:18 Speaker 04: All comments received in advance of the agenda publishing deadline were attached to the agenda.

00:05:23 Speaker 04: No one registered to attend the meeting electronically.

00:05:27 Speaker 04: For anyone here for the public meeting, please sign the sign-in sheet located on the table just outside of council chambers.

00:05:33 Speaker 04: Personal information collected at this public meeting is collected under the authority of the Planning Act,

00:05:37 Speaker 04: and the information collected will be used to complete the zoning bylaw amendment process and will form part of the public record.

00:05:43 Speaker 04: Questions about this collection should be addressed to myself, the city clerk.

00:05:47 Speaker 04: If you wish to be notified of the decision of the Corporation of the City of Owen Sound on the proposed zoning bylaw amendment application,

00:05:53 Speaker 04: you must make a written request to the City of Owen Sound, care of the city clerk.

00:05:58 Speaker 04: Good.

00:05:58 Speaker 01: Thank you.

00:05:59 Speaker 01: Now we will receive the presentation from the Manager of Planning and Heritage.

00:06:13 Speaker 05: Thank you, and through you, Chair.

00:06:15 Speaker 05: Thank you, and good evening, members of Council, staff, and members of the public.

00:06:18 Speaker 05: We are here this evening to hold a public meeting to gain input regarding Zoning Bylaw Amendment Number 59,

00:06:24 Speaker 05: which proposes to permit a semi-detached dwelling on lands municipally known as Ten Thirty-Eight Sixth Avenue West and lands legally described as Part One, Plan Sixteen R12308.

00:06:37 Speaker 05: The applicant, Barry's Construction and Insulation Limited, is in attendance this evening.

00:06:45 Speaker 05: The land subject to the requested Zoning Bylaw Amendment comprised two separate properties located just off the intersection of Tenth Street West and Sixth Avenue West.

00:06:56 Speaker 05: The first property is municipally known as Ten Thirty-Eight Sixth Avenue West.

00:07:00 Speaker 05: The other property does not yet have a municipal address assigned; however, it is legally described as Part One of Plan Sixteen R12308.

00:07:10 Speaker 05: I'll refer to this property as Part One for the sake of expediency going forward.

00:07:15 Speaker 05: The Part One was severed from the adjacent property to the south, municipally known as Tenth Sixth Avenue West, in 2025.

00:07:22 Speaker 05: An aerial photo of the subject land is shown on the slide before you.

00:07:28 Speaker 05: The lands municipally known as Ten Thirty-Eight have approximately 26 metres of frontage along Sixth Avenue West, 20.3 metres of lot depth, and five hundred and fifty-eight square metres of lot area,

00:07:40 Speaker 05: and currently contain an existing single detached dwelling fronting and gaining vehicular access via Sixth Avenue West.

00:07:47 Speaker 05: The lands legally described as Part One have twelve metres of frontage along Sixth Avenue West, twenty-six metres of lot depth, and two hundred and forty-nine square metres of lot area, and are currently vacant.

00:07:59 Speaker 05: These lands abut an existing single detached dwelling with an accessory residential unit to the west on lands municipally known as Tenth, 10th, 6th Avenue West, and as noted earlier,

00:08:08 Speaker 05: were severed from those lands in 2025.

00:08:12 Speaker 05: Surrounding land uses to the subject lands include: to the north, an unopened city lane; residential uses along Sixth Avenue West and Eleventh Street West; to the east,

00:08:21 Speaker 05: residential uses on the east side of Sixth Avenue West and along Tenth Street A West, as well as hazard lands associated with a slope; to the south,

00:08:30 Speaker 05: commercial and institutional uses existing on Tenth Street West and residential uses along Sixth Avenue West, south of Tenth Street; to the west, commercial uses existing on the north side of Tenth Street West.

00:08:45 Speaker 05: The subject lands are designated West City Commercial under the city's 2021 Official Plan, as well as the city's 2026 Official Plan update,

00:08:54 Speaker 05: which was adopted by Council on April 13th but is not yet in force and effect.

00:08:59 Speaker 05: Medium density forms of housing are among those uses permitted within the West City Commercial Designation, and this does not change between the 2021 and 2026 Official Plans.

00:09:09 Speaker 05: The lands are zoned Retail Commercial C-2 by the city's Zoning Bylaw 2010-078, which is currently in force and effect, as well as the 2026 Zoning Bylaw update through ZBA 59,

00:09:21 Speaker 05: which is yet not yet in force and effect.

00:09:26 Speaker 05: The purpose of... oh, sorry, the applicant is proposing to develop the lands for a semi-detached dwelling,

00:09:34 Speaker 05: and the reason for the Zoning Bylaw Amendment is that a semi-detached dwelling is not a permitted use in the Retail Commercial C-2 zone.

00:09:40 Speaker 05: As part of the development process, the applicant will submit consent applications to sever 1038 Sixth Avenue West into two parcels.

00:09:50 Speaker 05: The effect of the application is to apply site-specific zoning provisions to the lands to permit the use of a semi-detached dwelling in the C-2 zone and provide site-specific site and building regulations with respect to

00:10:03 Speaker 05: lot area,

00:10:04 Speaker 05: lot coverage, and front and rear setbacks.

00:10:09 Speaker 05: The city Zoning Bylaw does not provide site and building regulations for a semi-detached dwelling in the C-2 Zone as it is not a permitted use.

00:10:17 Speaker 05: Planning staff have evaluated the proposal using the general residential R5 zone provisions for a semi-detached dwelling under the 2010 Zoning Bylaw and the medium density residential Medium-Density Residential R2 zone provisions under the updated Zoning

00:10:31 Speaker 05: Bylaw.

00:10:32 Speaker 05: The requested site-specific zone provisions for lot area, lot coverage, frontage... or sorry front and rear setback for the proposed semi-detached dwelling are shown on the slide.

00:10:44 Speaker 05: As noted, 1038 Sixth Avenue West contains an existing single detached dwelling which is proposed to be located on the retained lot as part of the future consent application.

00:10:53 Speaker 05: The requested Zoning Bylaw Amendment will also permit the existing single detached dwelling within the C-2 Zone and provide site-specific zoning provisions for lot area and front yard setbacks.

00:11:06 Speaker 05: The applicant has submitted a fully dimensioned site plan in support of the requested Zoning Bylaw Amendment, an excerpt of which is shown on the slide.

00:11:14 Speaker 05: Outlined in red and green are the proposed semi-detached dwelling lots.

00:11:18 Speaker 05: A lot addition is also proposed, highlighted in yellow,

00:11:21 Speaker 05: that will sever approximately 0.88 metres from eight metres from the lands legally described as Part One and convey it to the proposed severed parcel so that each of the semi-detached lots has approximately eleven metres

00:11:34 Speaker 05: of frontage on Sixth Avenue West and two hundred and thirty square metres of lot area.

00:11:39 Speaker 05: The proposed retained lot containing the existing single detached dwelling at Ten Thirty-Eight is outlined in pink at the top.

00:11:48 Speaker 05: The applicant has submitted a complete rezoning application with the required supporting plans and studies as listed here.

00:11:54 Speaker 05: These items are all available for review on the city's website under active planning applications.

00:12:01 Speaker 05: The process completed thus far, as it relates to the requested Zoning Bylaw Amendment, is summarised on the slide before you.

00:12:07 Speaker 05: Notice of Complete Application and public meeting were given together by posting a sign on the subject property and by mailing to landowners within 120 metres of the property on July 2nd.

00:12:16 Speaker 05: The technical report included in tonight's agenda is intended to describe the proposed Zoning Bylaw Amendment, post-Zoning Bylaw Amendment,

00:12:22 Speaker 05: and outlines the key policy considerations of the provincial planning statement and the county and city Official Plans relevant to the evaluation of the application.

00:12:33 Speaker 05: Staff will take the public, agency, and staff comments received through the process and review them in the Policy Context in the recommendation report which is expected to come before Council on September 14th.

00:12:45 Speaker 05: Thank you.

00:12:47 Speaker 05: Good.

00:12:47 Speaker 05: Thank you very much.

00:12:49 Speaker 01: And next we'll have a presentation from Mr. Crystal Brink of Barry's Construction and Insulation Limited.

00:13:03 Speaker 01: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, Council Members, and Staff.

00:13:06 Speaker 01: My name is Barry Crystal Brink, Barry's Construction.

00:13:09 Speaker 06: I'm here.

00:13:10 Speaker 06: I'm totally in support of this.

00:13:12 Speaker 06: What staff has written up, planners... and I'm here basically to answer any questions if anything comes up.

00:13:18 Speaker 06: That's about it.

00:13:20 Speaker 06: Thank you.

00:13:22 Speaker 01: So next we have comments from the public.

00:13:26 Speaker 01: So if you are here to speak to this, we ask you to state your name and the municipality in which you reside, and state your comments.

00:13:39 Speaker 01: Not seeing anybody going to the microphone.

00:13:41 Speaker 01: No one wishes to speak to this.

00:13:43 Speaker 01: This is your opportunity.

00:13:46 Speaker 01: Okay.

00:13:48 Speaker 01: So with that given that no one from the public is speaking then I will declare the public meeting closed and continue with the meeting.

00:13:56 Speaker 01: Thank you, Sabine.

00:13:57 Speaker 01: Thank you, Mr. Chris Brink.

00:14:04 Speaker 01: Next on our agenda, number seven A, we have a deputation from Annette Pedler, Executive Director of Safe and Sound, with regard to neighbourhood response team pilot project.

00:14:30 Speaker 01: Thank you so much for having me tonight.

00:14:32 Speaker 01: As was said, my name is Annette Pedler.

00:14:33 Speaker 01: I'm the proud executive director of Safe and Sound.

00:14:36 Speaker 07: I've been in that role for about three years now, and I'm here today to give a report on the neighbourhood response team.

00:14:43 Speaker 07: So I'm also joining me today is Karen Wheeler.

00:14:47 Speaker 07: Karen was one of the staff and a part of the neighbourhood response team, and so she's going to share a bit about her experience working on the team as well.

00:14:57 Speaker 07: And so, as you all are aware, it's kind of a two-part deputation.

00:15:03 Speaker 07: So the first one is going to strictly be about the neighbourhood response team, and then we'll move on to further matters later.

00:15:09 Speaker 07: But hopefully, we can address any questions about the NRT specifically within this time allotment.

00:15:16 Speaker 07: The purpose of our delegation today is to really let you all know how it went,

00:15:21 Speaker 07: and also to seek a letter of support for an upcoming grant that we're doing with the Trillium Foundation to have this project funded moving forward.

00:15:29 Speaker 07: So there's the team, and I'll also give a shout out to Kurt, who's in attendance today.

00:15:35 Speaker 07: He was also on the team.

00:15:36 Speaker 07: So thanks for his support.

00:15:37 Speaker 07: But I'll let Karen share now about her experience.

00:15:40 Speaker 07: Good afternoon, Mayor, members of Council, and members of our community.

00:15:48 Speaker 07: My name is Karen, and I had the privilege of serving as one of the four outreach workers of Owen Sound's Neighbourhood Response Team.

00:15:55 Speaker 08: Before I begin, I would like to ask everyone to take a moment to look around the room.

00:16:00 Speaker 08: Stats Canada tells us that one of every five people in this room struggle with substance use disorder throughout their lifetime.

00:16:08 Speaker 08: By age forty, one in two Canadians will have experienced or are currently experiencing a mental illness.

00:16:18 Speaker 08: Mental illness and substance use disorders are among the leading causes of disability in Canada.

00:16:24 Speaker 08: Those aren't just statistics; they represent people.

00:16:28 Speaker 08: They represent our neighbours, co-workers, friends, parents, children, and loved ones.

00:16:34 Speaker 08: They represent people in every neighbourhood, every workplace, and every family.

00:16:37 Speaker 08: When I joined the neighbourhood response team, I quickly realized that the people we encountered downtown were only a visible part of a much larger issue.

00:16:47 Speaker 08: Behind every person experiencing homelessness, addiction, or mental illness was a story of trauma, grief, illness, or circumstances that could happen to any one of us.

00:16:58 Speaker 08: These challenges do not discriminate.

00:17:01 Speaker 08: One thing became very clear: we could not solve these issues by simply asking people to move along.

00:17:07 Speaker 08: I want to recognize the important work Grey County has done to expand housing and support services.

00:17:13 Speaker 08: Those investments are essential, but housing and services alone are not enough if people cannot access them.

00:17:20 Speaker 08: This is where the neighbourhood response team made a difference.

00:17:23 Speaker 08: Our role was to meet people where they were, both physically and emotionally.

00:17:28 Speaker 08: We built trust with individuals who often had little or no connection to traditional services.

00:17:34 Speaker 08: Once that trust was established, we helped connect people to healthcare, housing, identification, income supports, addiction treatment, mental health services, and other community resources.

00:17:46 Speaker 08: We walked alongside people as they navigated complex systems, always treating them with dignity, respect, and compassion.

00:17:55 Speaker 08: Our work also included many practical tasks that often went unnoticed but had a real impact in our community.

00:18:02 Speaker 08: We returned abandoned shopping carts to local businesses, helped people safely dispose of belongings that had become unsafe or unmanageable, and made every effort to return lost property to the rightful owners.

00:18:15 Speaker 08: These may seem like small actions, but they improved the appearance of our downtown, strengthened relationships with local businesses, and helped preserve the dignity of the people we served.

00:18:25 Speaker 08: The neighbourhood response team was never just about helping individuals; it was about making our entire community healthier and safer.

00:18:35 Speaker 08: By intervening early, we helped reduce unnecessary emergency room visits, EMS calls, and police interactions.

00:18:43 Speaker 08: We often prevented situations from escalating into crisis, reducing pressure on the emergency services while creating a safer public space for residents, businesses, visitors, and the vulnerable individuals alike.

00:18:58 Speaker 08: Outreach is not simply compassion; it's practical.

00:19:03 Speaker 08: It's proactive, evidence-based, and cost-effective.

00:19:06 Speaker 08: It connects people with support before they reach a crisis, reducing the need for more expensive emergency interventions later.

00:19:14 Speaker 08: I know this work matters because I've witnessed its impact firsthand.

00:19:18 Speaker 08: I've seen people reconnect with healthcare, obtain identification, secure housing, begin addiction treatment, and rebuild relationships with family and community.

00:19:30 Speaker 08: These successes really change lives.

00:19:32 Speaker 08: And every one of these successes represents someone moving from crisis towards stability.

00:19:38 Speaker 08: Supporting outreach is not simply an investment in social services; it's an investment in public safety, community well-being, and fiscal responsibility.

00:19:46 Speaker 08: It reflects a commitment to addressing complex challenges without relying on temporary fixes but with thoughtful, effective solutions instead.

00:19:55 Speaker 08: I respectfully ask Council to support the neighbourhood response team.

00:20:01 Speaker 08: Outreach is not an optional service; it's a vital part of coordinated response to homelessness, addiction, mental illness, and poverty.

00:20:09 Speaker 08: It strengthens our community while improving outcomes for everyone who calls Owen Sound home.

00:20:14 Speaker 08: Thank you for your time, your leadership, and your continued commitment to the people of Owen Sound.

00:20:19 Speaker 08: Before I pass things over to Annette, I'd like to leave you with one final thought: Your obvious is someone else's impossible.

00:20:28 Speaker 08: For many of us, making a phone call, filling out a form, or attending an appointment, or asking for help seems simple.

00:20:34 Speaker 08: For someone living with trauma, mental illness, addiction, or homelessness, these tasks can feel impossible.

00:20:42 Speaker 08: Sometimes, the difference between remaining in crisis and taking the first step toward recovery is simply having someone willing to walk beside you.

00:20:50 Speaker 08: That is what the neighbourhood response team did every day.

00:20:56 Speaker 08: Thank you, Karen.

00:20:57 Speaker 08: That was awesome.

00:20:59 Speaker 07: So as you can see up on the board here, the neighbourhood response team was available as a public service through a publicly available phone number.

00:21:11 Speaker 07: During the pilot period, which was from November 1st until the end of March, the target area was really in the River District Plus, and so the majority of the calls were in the River District,

00:21:23 Speaker 07: but then we also extended it to include some other partners like M'Wikwedong to be in the catchment area as well.

00:21:32 Speaker 07: In that time, there was over two thousand direct supports given to individuals on the streets, and as Karen said, this was a huge range;

00:21:43 Speaker 07: you can see here about the different supports people received and the different hands that were offered.

00:21:52 Speaker 07: Because of time, I might not read through all this community feedback.

00:21:57 Speaker 07: But within the report that was submitted as additional materials, you can read some of the feedback from different local businesses.

00:22:07 Speaker 07: The businesses were very supportive and happy with this service.

00:22:11 Speaker 07: The reality is we need somewhere else for people to call.

00:22:15 Speaker 07: Our emergency services are under a great deal of strain, and it's significantly financially costly endeavor to call the police every time somebody is on a bench crying, every time somebody is sleeping in a doorway,

00:22:29 Speaker 07: or every time somebody knocks over a garbage can.

00:22:33 Speaker 07: These kinds of things—we can have a community-driven solution rather than bringing the police in—and that is something we need to figure out how to integrate as part of our everyday community because we need our

00:22:45 Speaker 07: police doing police matters,

00:22:47 Speaker 07: and those matters are simply not criminal matters.

00:22:51 Speaker 07: So for this past pilot project, we received one hundred and fifty-two thousand dollars,

00:22:56 Speaker 07: and then the projection for the cost for the programme moving forward for a full year is just under three hundred thousand dollars.

00:23:06 Speaker 07: And again, when we look at that in relation to other numbers you can currently call for somebody who will come and assist business owners and community members—they need support right then in the moment.

00:23:21 Speaker 07: They need a number they can call, and they need somebody who can come and help.

00:23:25 Speaker 07: That's what the NRT is trying to address within the community.

00:23:31 Speaker 07: So as I mentioned, the Trillium grant is our next step, and I think it's important to recognize that the City could have a role in funding this in the future.

00:23:42 Speaker 07: But today's ask is for support—a letter of support for that Trillium grant.

00:23:47 Speaker 07: I also kind of want people to start thinking about people walking around downtown with vests supporting others; that has many different names, but it's also a support of tourism and supports many things.

00:24:03 Speaker 07: And so I think if we look at the future, we hope to have other partners come on board because this is not just supporting homelessness;

00:24:11 Speaker 07: this is supporting our community in a lot of different ways.

00:24:15 Speaker 07: So I know I've left little time for questions.

00:24:18 Speaker 07: But if it's a quick one, I think we can break with questions, Councillor Merton.

00:24:27 Speaker 02: Through you, Mayor, I would like to make a motion that we send a letter of support along with an assistance fund or similar mechanism for the Trillium Grant application for this project.

00:24:42 Speaker 09: Just before I recognize the motion: are there any other questions?

00:24:45 Speaker 09: I'm just thinking about order for a net on this issue.

00:24:50 Speaker 09: Go ahead.

00:24:54 Speaker 03: Thank you, through the mayor.

00:24:55 Speaker 03: I want to highlight that this is exactly the kind of upstream and non-emergency service response that the Community Safety and Wellbeing Plan framework identifies as being more effective, better for people, and more cost-effective.

00:25:07 Speaker 03: And like we heard: let's police do police things.

00:25:14 Speaker 03: I'm curious—the duration of this pilot was through a really brutal winter,

00:25:22 Speaker 03: and the report that accompanied it spoke to the physical health impacts of having people without sufficient footwear outside in wet conditions all of the time.

00:25:35 Speaker 03: I was hoping to just maybe hear some more information about what that large number of wellness and health-related interactions might look like in the context of it being really cold and people not necessarily having

00:25:51 Speaker 03: what they need.

00:26:00 Speaker 07: Through you, Mayor.

00:26:03 Speaker 07: Thanks, John, for your question.

00:26:04 Speaker 07: Yeah, I think that the best people to ask that question are really the emergency room staff because that's where we're seeing that play out.

00:26:15 Speaker 07: The impact is terrible on our wait times when we go up to the hospital.

00:26:25 Speaker 07: It's disabling: somebody lost both of his legs this winter.

00:26:30 Speaker 07: There's a cost to that that the community needs to carry forward in much longer term.

00:26:36 Speaker 07: Homelessness is really violent for people; it's violent to their bodies to be outside, and that violence does carry physical manifestations—certainly the loss of fingers, limbs, toes.

00:26:50 Speaker 07: That's something many of the people here supporting this project tonight need to deal with on a daily basis.

00:27:00 Speaker 07: It burdens a lot of different systems around us, and we need more socks for people and dry boots for people.

00:27:10 Speaker 07: The first winter before Safe and Sound was open overnight, there was a gentleman who was hospitalized for six weeks with frostbite on his hands.

00:27:20 Speaker 07: It cost our community more to have that gentleman in the hospital for six weeks than it would have cost us to fund Safe and Sound for that year so he wasn't sleeping outside.

00:27:32 Speaker 07: So I think yeah—thank you for your question.

00:27:34 Speaker 07: And this is where homelessness ripples are really being felt in places that aren't within Safe and Sound.

00:27:46 Speaker 01: Going this way, no hands are going up.

00:27:47 Speaker 01: I'll go back to Carol's motion: which is that staff write a letter to support the grant application.

00:27:55 Speaker 01: Any questions on that?

00:28:02 Speaker 10: Just without having that ahead of time, I think just to be safe, I better declare a pecuniary interest as I work for the Government of Ontario.

00:28:10 Speaker 10: Okay—call the question on this item.

00:28:16 Speaker 10: I'd just like to say that's not something I can support.

00:28:19 Speaker 11: The last couple years we've heard from various people in the community who seemingly don't have a voice through a plethora of means when they talk about perhaps a moratorium on service provision downtown.

00:28:30 Speaker 11: Service provision downtown should be something that we examine.

00:28:34 Speaker 11: This is a continuation then of what can become potentially a self-fulfilling, circular action: where the more services you provide, the more invitation you have to individuals from outside our community.

00:28:48 Speaker 11: I'm looking right now at names listed in Gray County's homelessness plan—or housing plan—140 people experiencing homelessness in spring 2026; 39 are unhoused.

00:28:57 Speaker 11: Thirty-nine are unhoused unless it can be mitigated with offsetting costs in the SOS programme, which does a lot of this work.

00:29:06 Speaker 11: There are various other service providers in the community.

00:29:11 Speaker 11: We heard some great stories from OSHaRE—they've got medical practitioners there in partnership with the SOS programme as well, providing some services.

00:29:23 Speaker 11: So at this time—even the comment about police—that should be backed up with stats and data and information to support it.

00:29:33 Speaker 11: You can't just make a claim that it removed a certain amount of call volume; you've got to substantiate that with something.

00:29:42 Speaker 11: I haven't seen that, so not something I can support.

00:29:46 Speaker 11: Anyone else?

00:29:47 Speaker 11: Councillor Farmer: first, if the Mayor will humor me—I think the Deputy Mayor's comments bring up the question of how is the Neighbourhood Response Team different than supportive outreach services through United Way?

00:29:59 Speaker 03: We have people in the room from both organisations; I think it would be helpful for all of us to hear how those two services are different, if that's possible.

00:30:08 Speaker 03: No—we're not getting so long an agenda anyway.

00:30:10 Speaker 01: We've got ten minutes and we're beyond it.

00:30:13 Speaker 01: I think it's a straightforward motion.

00:30:15 Speaker 01: Anyone else wish to speak to the motion?

00:30:19 Speaker 01: Through the Mayor: I'm totally in support of the motion.

00:30:24 Speaker 12: It's always interesting to me to hear where arguments like the one the Deputy Mayor made are deployed.

00:30:28 Speaker 12: We don't talk about oncology patients flooding our community because we offer services here; we don't talk about that for seniors who need supportive living.

00:30:40 Speaker 12: To have that kind of argument focused only on people who are most vulnerable really just entrenches an idea that some people deserve having their humanity recognized and others aren't deserving,

00:30:53 Speaker 12: I think—and we should reject that.

00:30:55 Speaker 12: We're here for everyone in Owen Sound.

00:30:57 Speaker 12: Having more people downtown employed to take care of both people and spaces: so if a business owner finds sharp objects or paraphernalia in front of their door when they come in the morning,

00:31:14 Speaker 12: there's a number they can call; trained staff whose job it is will come clean up.

00:31:19 Speaker 12: It's not city staff who needs to do that—it's not Public Health that needs to do that, nor police.

00:31:26 Speaker 12: This is clearly an asset to our community and much cheaper than calling Public Works or Public Health.

00:31:33 Speaker 12: I think we'd be foolish not to join the Chamber of Commerce, OSHaRE, and all other community organisations saying this is a benefit; it deserves support.

00:31:47 Speaker 12: And if we're not going to fund that locally,

00:31:48 Speaker 12: then we should make sure people willing to run it and do the work to meet that obvious community need have all resources they need in order to be successful finding grant funding from elsewhere.

00:32:01 Speaker 12: Because if we're not finding grant funding for this here, we'll pay more city employees to do more cleaning and more police officers to show up for people having a bad day but doing nothing criminal.

00:32:14 Speaker 12: I've seen personally how just knowing someone's name and saying "Hey, what's wrong?"

00:32:18 Speaker 12: when they're yelling in the street can give them a chance to say: "I'm having a bad day; it's end of month; I'm out of money; my friend did something really mean to me."

00:32:27 Speaker 12: That conversation can de-escalate someone in distress because they don't have a private place to be.

00:32:34 Speaker 12: That's just being human, and we should fund more humane services with a letter of support.

00:32:51 Speaker 01: Come on!

00:32:52 Speaker 01: This is a council meeting—we're conducting business of the city; it's not a stage or presentation.

00:33:00 Speaker 13: Go ahead—thank you, Worshipful Mayor.

00:33:05 Speaker 13: You said total allocation for year anticipated costs are going to be three hundred thousand, just shy of that.

00:33:11 Speaker 13: So last year you were in partnership with Grey County—I'm assuming you've done this presentation with Grey County?

00:33:16 Speaker 13: Assuming so: I'll give you one second because once you answer, I have to turn mine off.

00:33:21 Speaker 13: So regarding the presentation to Grey County—have they offered any level of support as well?

00:33:29 Speaker 13: Secondary question: let's just say you don't receive Ontario Trillium Foundation grant funding; what does that put into your plans for next steps?

00:33:39 Speaker 13: Is it a request back to Council to fund that programme, or will that be a financial request going back to the county?

00:33:48 Speaker 13: That'll be my first part of answer—and second part.

00:33:53 Speaker 13: At River District Board we've talked about downtown River District ambassador programme—they have one like that in Collingwood where someone shares tourism perspective;

00:34:07 Speaker 13: I'm just trying to grasp when you originally said what you envision NRT looking like: is that leading toward a tourism ambassador component in downtown core, or what do you envision this looking like in future?

00:34:26 Speaker 13: Two parts to answer.

00:34:30 Speaker 07: Thank you—and through your Mayor.

00:34:33 Speaker 07: First of all it wasn't county money funding this; it was flow-through from the county—not financially supported by nor funded through county.

00:34:47 Speaker 07: I did report to Human Services Committee (sorry—Community Services) of Grey County and will seek letter of support from them as well for Trillium application.

00:35:01 Speaker 07: Grey County is large place—I don't want speak for Grey County—but their resources need allocated in wide geographical area; when talking about something so specific to River District,

00:35:18 Speaker 07: first stop is people who are of the River District—and Owen Sound just one part of Grey County whole.

00:35:27 Speaker 07: And what happens if not funded by Trillium?

00:35:34 Speaker 07: Thing is: these community-driven solutions that are evidence-based and cheaper for our community as a whole will always continue come up as best solution.

00:35:49 Speaker 07: Whether time now to fund it, maybe doesn't get funded by Trillium or gets funded now—but continues because we need other supports available within community.

00:36:04 Speaker 07: So if not funded by Trillium: sure—maybe I'll come back ask City Council; maybe continue seek other grants; will ask Grey County as well.

00:36:14 Speaker 07: We're not going stop trying find funding path to it because continuing be right solution for our community.

00:36:24 Speaker 07: Whether me or whoever in future—it continues brought forward.

00:36:34 Speaker 07: Then second part question: really want us all understand these services not single type of service.

00:36:43 Speaker 07: When having somebody walk around downtown supporting people—you're not just tourism, nor homelessness, nor whatever you know—and trying understand integrating solutions together because best solutions for tourism often also best for homelessness too;

00:37:06 Speaker 07: so need think less as just tourism programme in future or just homelessness programme—alleviating visible homelessness downtown will help tourism anyway.

00:37:19 Speaker 07: So think we need be little bit less worried about specific mandates and open up ideas through actual collaboration partnership.

00:37:33 Speaker 07: Maybe answering lot questions through same initiative—not seeing other hands going up.

00:37:44 Speaker 01: Several years ago I went to AMO; specialist from Waterloo (not Guelph, Sudbury) had whole list of what they working on—all great things we need do—and each one those we were doing in Grey County already.

00:38:08 Speaker 01: Francesca went to Timmins and came back same conclusion: this just one more opportunity liaison between businesses—I know couple that get pretty frustrated.

00:38:21 Speaker 01: I think unfortunate your pilot was November through March not May 1st through September 30th; would have been little bit different.

00:38:32 Speaker 01: Need perfect it a little but how do you perfect in six months?

00:38:37 Speaker 01: So supporting Carol's motion—will call question.

00:38:40 Speaker 01: Who favour?

00:38:40 Speaker 01: One, two, three, four, five, six—and I seven—that carried.

00:38:46 Speaker 01: Thank you.

00:38:54 Speaker 01: Oddly enough: seven B is deputation from Annette Pedler (Net Peddler), Executive Director Safe and Sound Emergency Shelter Facility.

00:39:06 Speaker 07: Thank you not kicking me out yet.

00:39:13 Speaker 07: Next thing speaking services downtown: emergency shelter facility opening at 612 Second Avenue East.

00:39:23 Speaker 07: Going talk first briefly about what Safe and Sound overnight services been last couple years; then new facility; then take minute reflect where community headed plus role see city playing in this—and hopefully questions.

00:39:50 Speaker 07: So 2024 was first year open overnight—as you can see average nightly stays—biggest month twenty-four people.

00:39:59 Speaker 07: Fast forward past year third year being twenty-four-hour service numbers significantly increased especially end of year.

00:40:10 Speaker 07: Obviously hugely challenging how worked up until point; safe and sound catch-all for any system not working for people: if somebody hospital, Grey County motel programme,

00:40:36 Speaker 07: or facility—not fit—we really where people end when system somewhere failed them.

00:40:44 Speaker 07: That's why thinking solutions very integrated within lot other systems because reasons needing access services also integrated into lot other systems community.

00:41:05 Speaker 07: About who stays space needs clear many accessing safe and sound have disability part minority particularly Indigenous:

00:41:18 Speaker 07: locally our Indigenous population two-four but total twenty-seven nights stayed facility—Indigenous members more than eleven times likely need Safe and Sound services.

00:41:45 Speaker 07: Longer horizon understand not just last five years in Owen Sound; this set decades—we left holding lot generations failures families.

00:42:04 Speaker 07: Total Safe and Sound received from Grey County four hundred thirty-five thousand dollars operating costs equals ninety-one dollar per night (seventy-one?—math not great because accounting paying day services have more people).

00:42:37 Speaker 07: So started two thousand seven goal addressing lack housing community next iteration twenty-four bed shelter facility—not lot time go through iterations shelters so stick explaining dormitory style plus spots five other awake.

00:43:08 Speaker 07: Operational year-round only open nights main reason space itself not big: once put twelve bunk beds becomes sleeping quarters challenging anything else;

00:43:37 Speaker 07: received federal funding five hundred thousand dollars purchase building fantastic but barely get single family home let alone building dozens folks experiencing homelessness—this facility acquired.

00:43:56 Speaker 07: Screen plans building front area shower washroom staff office plus vestibule where awake people stay—we don't want if you here sleeping—if awake out because not good neighbour great for someone living beside us additional capacity five

00:44:59 Speaker 07: awake in facility able be additionally vestibule give restrictions individuals conduct community—not just building property but around facility too makes challenging moments especially frontline asked carry way too much when 2:30 a.m. and so-and-so can't come

00:45:23 Speaker 07: in minus twenty-five degrees standing about die—vestibule airway have people enter shelter elements appropriate time before asked leave again then back sleeping quarters gendered total twenty-four beds ramp barrier free facility previous slide highlight basement don't

00:46:18 Speaker 07: want staff spread out everyone same level one larger room where partner agencies desks idea stay open until eight o'clock sorry nine morning partners start days building connect service users before even get out day help

00:46:38 Speaker 07: cut some time hospitals community treatment team SOS CMHA M'Wikwedong housing programme amongst others letters support received were for partners intend space too model move forward different services coming people meeting literally where they at.

00:47:15 Speaker 07: Where community going less than two minutes:

00:47:23 Speaker 07: really important know homelessness solvable problem Owen Sound Canada biggest first problem lack belief making happen lot elected mostly don't think possibility community asking yourselves how distancing bringing closer solutions what events?

00:47:59 Speaker 07: Most room tonight running service working volunteering no lack solutions everyone says "must hopeless" keep thinking not hopeless because haven tried common sense solutions needed if try perhaps feeling hopeful really am solutions closer than people

00:48:44 Speaker 07: believe city role starts individual understand sphere influence can do what city does ask more collaboration partnership lot sitting waiting invitation whatever meeting tour want go on here have solutions excited proud share.

00:49:21 Speaker 07: Thank you thank you Andy go ahead Yeah presentation plan build facility obviously curious operational plan couldn't help read how Shores Police planning transfer folks Owen Sound overnight stays question plan if more people than beds

00:49:51 Speaker 07: result thought situations defer deputy mayor county council community services committee bit misunderstanding role housing state we simply one service state using meet last couple years said anybody need place stay open doors happened not dignified

00:50:40 Speaker 07: overcrowded can't continue provide twenty-four beds five awake then role county answer what happen call ask "does person have somewhere tonight?

00:51:00 Speaker 07: County programme?"

00:51:06 Speaker 07: address themselves rent private motel rooms when capacity amount housing county isn't fixed number significantly expand same Bruce Creek Child Family Services informed cannot youth facility must pay motel room moving forward asked Grey staff Marie

00:52:12 Speaker 07: Shaw Port Algon advised two brought coldest nights returned next day only all winter not Facebook everyone excited reality big hit questions fine still two coming full turning away heard yes overcapacity safe and Sound responsibility

00:52:30 Speaker 10: If Bruce County unable meet housing needs thank you Worship clarity anyone watching people part organisation brought city approving anything today just presentation inform municipal council what going zoning changing property convert daycare current facility no

00:53:26 Speaker 10: public meeting begs question planning host public meeting surrounding community neighborhoods communication direct potentially affected person turn park two doors down mill dam move further street been transparency words right there communication transparency people listen listened

00:53:45 Speaker 13: neighbourhood concerns live three blocks haven't received mail public meeting questions perception reality same outcome if answers not provide opportunity endeavor challenges kid ourselves means upset happy some upset what done interact neighbourhood affect honest affecting

00:54:28 Speaker 13: one way shape form positive negative everyone different experience tell when planning did thought communicated neighbourhood met neighbours especially immediately around facility giving direct input fence look forwarded contractor today conversations happening also start community services

00:55:23 Speaker 13: or neighbourhood committee board member spearheading keep context safe and Sound me non-direct service providing staff half financial manager capacity not direct provider need more education support meaning shelter community role city county two work bees

00:56:00 Speaker 07: open house grand opening behind cloak attend public meeting every time anyone finds out where work do constantly living addressing issues daily go ahead appreciate still walked street listened people say going back original comment looking

00:56:46 Speaker 07: positive success surrounding neighbourhood would have done zoning change heard support opposed information first chance publicly television chamber provide input what doing facility words ears open need education fair but space moving haven't hosted public meeting

00:57:22 Speaker 13: didn't need commonly neighbour thing want for success not mean rude perception Eighth Street negative some agree don't out there case something different different neighbourhood expectation try cut off positive solutions find people moving neighborhoods what

00:58:09 Speaker 13: can do communication two ways hope before open plan neighbourhood response team committee

00:58:14 Speaker 13: I would hope you're planning to set up something.

00:58:17 Speaker 13: Otherwise, I can tell you—and I'm not being mean here—but you will get negative feedback immediately.

00:58:25 Speaker 13: So I just feel like if your organisation wants a positive feel from your organisation, I think you need to have some communication with not just the three people around your facility.

00:58:35 Speaker 13: It will impact more people, and, from my perspective, we have public meetings all the time about things, but I just think that personally,

00:58:46 Speaker 13: I think you're going to run into some challenges if you don't do that.

00:58:51 Speaker 13: Okay, so I'm just looking at the clock at six thirty, and we've got twelve reports to go.

00:58:56 Speaker 13: So I'll go to Carol first.

00:59:04 Speaker 13: Through you, Mayor.

00:59:06 Speaker 02: I know; in fact, I sent you an email, and I talked to you before the meeting.

00:59:10 Speaker 02: So I'm bringing forward the question about statistics.

00:59:15 Speaker 02: As we are hearing this presentation, looking at the statistics you've provided, my analysis is that we're opening a facility that's underserving the need.

00:59:29 Speaker 02: Before the doors open—even with the sit-ups, stay awakes, and the beds, the bunk beds—we're not even meeting what you have identified as out there.

00:59:42 Speaker 02: And we know there is an increase in the unhoused in our area who are growing; we're going underwater as we're trying to swim upstream here.

00:59:57 Speaker 02: The county has an important role to play: How do we communicate back?

01:00:04 Speaker 02: Great, there's beds.

01:00:06 Speaker 02: There aren't enough beds, and what can be done?

01:00:10 Speaker 02: What's Plan B?

01:00:11 Speaker 02: Because otherwise, as we know, our service agencies will provide whatever they need for people to be outdoors with whatever is over their head or indoors under a roof,

01:00:24 Speaker 02: and I have a concern that we're already underserved before the winter even arrives.

01:00:30 Speaker 02: Councillor Farmer, one question for Annette, and two questions for staff.

01:00:37 Speaker 03: Just quickly: there was a comment about not having a place for youth.

01:00:41 Speaker 03: We hear a lot from various sources that the people coming to access services are not from here.

01:00:48 Speaker 03: Can you speak to that comment about youth?

01:00:51 Speaker 03: Because, to my understanding, the teenagers that are here are very much from here.

01:00:55 Speaker 03: Has Safe and Sound also been providing services to people under the age of eighteen?

01:01:00 Speaker 03: To answer through you, Mayor: Safe and Sound has been providing services to youth under the age of eighteen.

01:01:14 Speaker 07: Last winter, when I became aware that this wasn't just happenstance—that the youth's night kind of went sideways and they were ending up at Safe and Sound—and instead,

01:01:27 Speaker 07: that was the plan for the youth to be staying—we made a rule: okay, no more people under the age of eighteen are allowed in the facility after 10 p.m.

01:01:38 Speaker 07: The second night that was imposed or enacted, a youth was sexually assaulted in a snowbank downtown;

01:01:54 Speaker 07: so we then let the youth back in because the harm occurring when the door wasn't open to them was worse than what it would be otherwise.

01:02:05 Speaker 07: Of course, the youth have significant ties to Grey County, but so do the adults who access our services as well?

01:02:16 Speaker 07: We did a poll last summer of everywhere everyone went to high school,

01:02:21 Speaker 07: and over 90% of the people in attendance at Safe and Sound for that one-week period had gone to high school in Grey or Bruce County.

01:02:29 Speaker 07: And so this is really Owen Sound and local area folks accessing the service; also addressing Councillor Merton's question about—I think I partly answered that with—there will be people being turned away, and yes,

01:02:50 Speaker 07: I am actually quite tepid on the plan because it isn't meeting the full need.

01:02:56 Speaker 07: This is where it comes back to: we got five hundred thousand dollars, and that isn't enough to address this problem in full.

01:03:03 Speaker 07: The answer to that—and what I think that we all need as a community to start talking about—is a purpose-built facility that integrates medical beds.

01:03:12 Speaker 07: A lot of the people accessing Safe and Sound services are in medical conditions that aren't honestly probably believable for a lot of people regarding the kind of support they need from PSWs and nursing staff,

01:03:26 Speaker 07: and we don't want to be providing emergency shelter services; we want to be providing transitional housing.

01:03:33 Speaker 07: We want to provide pathways for people not just to survive another twenty-four hours.

01:03:39 Speaker 07: And I see very strongly the future in Owen Sound being one with a facility that brings a lot of services together and has transitional housing above addressing different people's medical needs.

01:03:52 Speaker 07: We are not going to talk tonight about our palliative care programme, but palliative care is a huge need in the homelessness sphere, and something we have a worker addressing.

01:04:02 Speaker 07: And so this is not our destination; this is just where we are today, and we will continue to build and learn from every endeavor we do,

01:04:15 Speaker 07: building towards a better future for all of our community.

01:04:20 Speaker 07: Okay, two questions for the City Manager: I'll just stack them, and if you need the second one repeated, feel free.

01:04:30 Speaker 07: One: We've heard that there's a plan from the city to develop regulations for emergency care establishments.

01:04:37 Speaker 12: Can you tell us how the new regulations might impact this new shelter?

01:04:40 Speaker 12: And secondly, what does the work plan from the city look like and timeline for outreach to stakeholders like Safe and Sound, Bright Shores,

01:04:48 Speaker 12: and the county to make sure that any increased regulation is mutually beneficial?

01:04:57 Speaker 12: Through you, Mayor, to Councillor Farmer.

01:04:59 Speaker 14: So staff are not currently proposing an emergency care bylaw on its own.

01:05:04 Speaker 14: We're looking at an update or a revision to the business licensing bylaw that could have elements of an emergency care pieces within it.

01:05:14 Speaker 14: We've just started looking at that now.

01:05:17 Speaker 14: The notion from bylaw would be to set up and speak with various stakeholders over the next few months.

01:05:23 Speaker 14: That being Owen Sound Police Services, Safe and Sound, United Way, the county, etc., and bring a report back at some point in the fall with an update to business licensing bylaw.

01:05:37 Speaker 14: Thank you, Mayor.

01:05:41 Speaker 14: Thank you, Annette, for the presentation.

01:05:42 Speaker 15: Just a quick question for my own general knowledge: that you meant the SOS programmes and the neighbourhood response team programmes and the shelter that you're proposing.

01:05:54 Speaker 15: So all these facilities, they are only in Owen Sound out of Grey County, or are there any other municipalities for Grey County, like where folks can go?

01:06:03 Speaker 15: Other than Safe and Sound.

01:06:06 Speaker 15: Thank you for your question through you, Mayor.

01:06:09 Speaker 07: SOS and the neighbourhood response team are not physical buildings, and they're not tied to anything physical.

01:06:16 Speaker 07: SOS is not also directly only tied to Grey County.

01:06:23 Speaker 07: Safe and Sound is somewhere that SOS provides services to, but some of the SOS folks in the crowd are much better to answer,

01:06:34 Speaker 07: but they host different clinics and drop-in times at various places across Grey County throughout the week at different days.

01:06:43 Speaker 07: So they'll go to Hanover.

01:06:44 Speaker 07: There's also one in Markdale.

01:06:46 Speaker 07: There's the Grey Bruce Health Access Centre that has a drop-in for people to access.

01:06:50 Speaker 07: Sorry, not the Grey Bruce Southeast; it's the Grey Bruce Health Access Centre.

01:06:54 Speaker 07: That has a drop-in for people to access.

01:06:57 Speaker 07: So I think that it is a great future to think about where a version of the NRT and Safe and Sound could be providing drop-in services outside of Owen Sound,

01:07:07 Speaker 07: but our capacity is not there now, and so SOS does a fantastic job at serving those other communities, but that is not the role of the NRT or of Safe and Sound.

01:07:20 Speaker 07: Go ahead.

01:07:22 Speaker 07: Thank you.

01:07:23 Speaker 11: And no denying that is a very valuable need in the community, and I think you've got a great location; the building itself.

01:07:31 Speaker 11: So great to see the plans that you've brought forward here tonight.

01:07:34 Speaker 11: And just going to build quickly off some comments from Councillor Farmer at the May committee meeting: at the County Community Services,

01:07:41 Speaker 11: you stated the public response to questions surrounding neighbours had been consulted and communicated with on June 15th.

01:07:51 Speaker 11: I got an email from a neighbouring resident and business owner in our community to express their strong concerns regarding the shelter.

01:08:00 Speaker 11: Staff responded to that email on June 24th after meeting with Safe and Sound during the week of the 15th to the 19th,

01:08:09 Speaker 11: which stated that Safe and Sound staff mentioned in that meeting they would be doing some community outreach and communication.

01:08:16 Speaker 11: So there's an example where I'm not sure what's been done.

01:08:22 Speaker 11: One thing was said at the county: that there'd already been outreach and communicating with neighbours; then I get an email that seems to contradict that to a certain extent.

01:08:32 Speaker 11: There's a letter attached in the package that supports the plans, both for the NRT and this one here tonight.

01:08:41 Speaker 11: It's from a public person identifying as a member of the public.

01:08:46 Speaker 11: Why does that individual get included in the correspondence to council?

01:08:52 Speaker 11: So, as a singular individual, as opposed to a multitude of various personalities that could have contributed various concerns.

01:09:00 Speaker 11: So at the end of the day,

01:09:02 Speaker 11: I do want to know more about how you're going to consult with the public and effectively how you're going to hold yourself accountable measured against concerns from surrounding neighbours and your response to them when

01:09:14 Speaker 11: you get them,

01:09:15 Speaker 11: because that is critical.

01:09:16 Speaker 11: The concerns are valid and real: when people have devaluation in their house value dependent upon sensitive uses that might be close by, that hits home for people.

01:09:31 Speaker 11: That's a very real concern, and it should be acknowledged.

01:09:34 Speaker 11: And we have to respond to it.

01:09:37 Speaker 11: So I guess that's what level of communication you're going to commit yourself to, and how are you going to hold yourself accountable to those concerns?

01:09:51 Speaker 11: I am first and foremost accountable to the participants of Safe and Sound.

01:09:56 Speaker 07: I am also accountable to the board of Safe and Sound.

01:10:00 Speaker 07: I am accountable to our funders.

01:10:02 Speaker 07: I am accountable to our neighbours.

01:10:04 Speaker 07: I am accountable as a community member within this community.

01:10:09 Speaker 07: So I think that trying to pick the singular way or quick answer about how I am going to be held accountability is not really fruitful conversation,

01:10:22 Speaker 07: but I'm hearing that more communication is needed from Safe and Sound, and I think we can take that back, and we can continue to do better at that.

01:10:32 Speaker 07: Unfortunately, we didn't have enough funding to continue to employ our communications manager, so they left the agency in January, and so that has a compounding effect when you don't fund places well enough;

01:10:47 Speaker 07: barely than just survive.

01:10:49 Speaker 07: You get results that are also partial.

01:10:51 Speaker 07: If you partially fund something, you have a partial result.

01:10:57 Speaker 07: And so we're going to have an open house for community members to come in and meet with people.

01:11:04 Speaker 07: And I think our board and I am very accessible.

01:11:11 Speaker 07: We are getting the letters and messages too.

01:11:14 Speaker 07: We are meeting and responding to the people; we are answering phone calls.

01:11:18 Speaker 07: And I do also think it's important to note that not all of some of the concerns are definitely valid, and some of them are really hateful.

01:11:29 Speaker 07: And some of the things being brought to my voicemail are really awful things.

01:11:37 Speaker 07: You know, I should put my truck in four-by-four and deal with this problem myself; you know, that kind of thing.

01:11:43 Speaker 07: So engaging... the only death threats I've received in this job are not through participants of Safe and Sound; it is through community members.

01:11:51 Speaker 07: So like, I think we can do a better job at communicating with the community around us.

01:11:59 Speaker 07: But I'm not concerned about a lack of avenues to hold me accountable for how all this goes.

01:12:07 Speaker 07: Melanie, thank you through your worship.

01:12:10 Speaker 16: Something just struck me when I was looking at your logo.

01:12:12 Speaker 16: I've always referred to you as Safe and Sound Owen Sound, but you're marketing yourself as Safe and Sound Grey Bruce.

01:12:17 Speaker 16: And I was just reading your mission statement; it says that you provide services to individuals experiencing homelessness, housing insecurity, poverty, and marginalization in Grey and Bruce counties.

01:12:29 Speaker 16: Where else are you located in Grey and Bruce counties other than in Owen Sound?

01:12:36 Speaker 16: So that name was circa 2007—so long before my time within Safe and Sound.

01:12:43 Speaker 07: Currently, as I said, our capacity is not limited to a physical presence outside of Owen Sound like a location.

01:12:51 Speaker 07: We had not had time today to talk about our palliative care programme,

01:12:56 Speaker 07: but we have a palliative care coordinator who works with people who are Indigenous or homeless across Grey and Bruce to help them get connected to palliative care services; so she travels significantly throughout the region,

01:13:11 Speaker 07: and currently that is the main way in which we are positively impacting the rest of the counties outside of Owen Sound.

01:13:21 Speaker 07: Thank you for that.

01:13:22 Speaker 16: Just in your comments earlier, you said that the county needs to spread services wider across the county.

01:13:29 Speaker 16: So I just feel like in your mission statement, you're kind of inviting Grey and Bruce to send people to you because it's in your mission statement: "Safe and Sound" located in Owen Sound,

01:13:42 Speaker 16: but your mission is providing service to all of Grey-Bruce, which I think is where a lot of the frustration from Owegians comes from.

01:13:50 Speaker 16: Because we feel like we are the homelessness hub of Grey-Bruce County, and we want services spread out across the county;

01:13:58 Speaker 16: it's up to our reps at the county level also to speak up that we want services spread out.

01:14:03 Speaker 16: We don't want to be the homeless hub.

01:14:04 Speaker 16: We feel people should be looked after in their community from which they come.

01:14:09 Speaker 16: So whether or not you have any role in going forward, I know funding is an issue always.

01:14:17 Speaker 16: But personally I would like to see services spread out across Grey County so that people can be looked after where they're from.

01:14:26 Speaker 16: Do you?

01:14:27 Speaker 16: Briefly, Mayor?

01:14:28 Speaker 16: I don't think...

01:14:29 Speaker 07: I'm not sure if that was something you thought I was going to disagree with, but obviously people need to be supported naturally within their own homes through their natural support system.

01:14:41 Speaker 07: So yes, of course people need to be able to stay closer to their natural supports.

01:14:54 Speaker 07: Grey-Bruce is a big area; maybe it's reflective of not really being an invitation if you already thought "Safe and Sound Owen Sound"—maybe the "Grey Bruce" thing isn't even registering for a lot of people.

01:15:08 Speaker 07: All right, I think we need to move on with our meeting.

01:15:11 Speaker 09: Thank you very much for coming in and presenting.

01:15:14 Speaker 09: And you know this is probably the first time... what you're doing is so important in the community.

01:15:23 Speaker 09: We all know what the community thinks because you already know.

01:15:29 Speaker 09: As you talk about phone calls you take, some of those are worse than what I get.

01:15:38 Speaker 09: There is concern regarding perception very clearly; that's been communicated with you tonight on Eight Street.

01:15:44 Speaker 09: I received more phone calls about people in front of your place on Eight Street than just about anything in the last little while.

01:15:59 Speaker 09: It has been different, and I encourage you to continue to listen to the community and what they're saying as well.

01:16:06 Speaker 09: It's a two-way street, and keep doing what you're doing, and keep trying to perfect it with your 15 employees and three volunteers.

01:16:14 Speaker 09: And but thanks, thanks for doing what you're doing.

01:16:19 Speaker 09: Thank you.

01:16:22 Speaker 09: So, so if you are here just for those, it's probably a good time to leave, and we'll just turn off the microphone because this is going to take a minute.

01:16:28 Speaker 09: We'll encourage you to go right outside because anything outside that door just echoes like crazy in here.

01:16:33 Speaker 09: So we'll just give you a minute.

01:17:21 Speaker 09: Okay, so we'll put it back in gear at seven C. We have a presentation from the city manager with regard to his update.

01:17:31 Speaker 09: Thank you, Mayor, and through you, I'll bring a brief city manager's update.

01:17:35 Speaker 14: It's the last or the second meeting of the month, of which I do every month for council.

01:17:40 Speaker 14: Highlights for the month thus far.

01:17:44 Speaker 14: So, highlights: July has been a busy month.

01:17:46 Speaker 14: Our bullet points on this slide speak to Camp Tom and sports camps are well underway.

01:17:51 Speaker 14: They're all at full capacity and remain at full capacity over the summer.

01:17:56 Speaker 14: Our Canada Day celebrations took place at Kelso Beach at Naywash Park.

01:17:59 Speaker 14: It was hugely successful.

01:18:01 Speaker 14: A lot of great feedback on Owen Sound's first drone show.

01:18:05 Speaker 14: Doors Open Owen Sound took place July 18th.

01:18:08 Speaker 14: We had a very strong turnout to the locations that participated in that.

01:18:12 Speaker 14: They got to explore the city's history, architecture, and cultural landmarks.

01:18:16 Speaker 14: TD Harbour Nights and midweek music have been taking place on Sunday and Wednesday evenings and continue to be well supported and attended.

01:18:24 Speaker 14: Arenas and banquet halls at the City have been very busy over June and July, and we're hosting a lacrosse tournament, graduations, proms, and more.

01:18:32 Speaker 14: Just some of the events happening around.

01:18:36 Speaker 14: We have multiple community improvement planning grants that have been approved to various properties throughout the Harbour and River District areas.

01:18:43 Speaker 14: We have the online survey for the park renaming at 823 Fifth Avenue East is now open at ourcity.owsound.ca, where the public can rank the names provided; the survey is open until the end of August,

01:18:56 Speaker 14: so another four weeks.

01:18:58 Speaker 14: The Owen Heights and Comeret Park playground replacements are complete.

01:19:01 Speaker 14: The new playground equipment is open for the public to enjoy.

01:19:04 Speaker 14: I know we've gotten some emails from public members in those neighborhoods really appreciating the new playground equipment.

01:19:11 Speaker 14: Multiple road construction projects are underway throughout the City.

01:19:15 Speaker 14: We know these cause temporary traffic disruptions.

01:19:19 Speaker 14: We thank everybody for your patience as these works are completed.

01:19:22 Speaker 14: I guess we are continually in two seasons here: winter and construction, and we're in the construction season right now.

01:19:29 Speaker 14: The Farmers Market Public Washroom Project has been completed; it is open for the public's use.

01:19:34 Speaker 14: However, there are some minor finishing touches that will be added in the coming weeks, and that includes some signage, et cetera.

01:19:41 Speaker 14: The 2026 municipal election is coming up, and this slide really is just for if you are interested in being a candidate.

01:19:48 Speaker 14: Nominations are now open and packages can be filed through August 21st at 2 p.m.

01:19:54 Speaker 14: So August 21st, 2 p.m. is the cutoff.

01:19:57 Speaker 14: For more information, please visit owensoundvotes.ca.

01:20:01 Speaker 14: In addition to that, if you want to make sure you're on the voters list, you might be new to the city or new to voting in this coming municipal election.

01:20:09 Speaker 14: To confirm, register, amend your information.

01:20:12 Speaker 14: Please register, register to vote.on.ca.

01:20:16 Speaker 14: So that's not a city website.

01:20:17 Speaker 14: That is a provincial website.

01:20:19 Speaker 14: Register to vote.on.ca, and you need to do that by August 12th of this year.

01:20:25 Speaker 14: Looking at our upcoming committee meetings for September.

01:20:27 Speaker 14: September 12th is the Tom Thomson Art Gallery Advisory Committee.

01:20:31 Speaker 14: We'll have an art gallery September update report.

01:20:37 Speaker 14: Service review implementation ad hoc committee is scheduled for Wednesday, September 9th.

01:20:41 Speaker 14: We'll have a report through that on revenue and KPIs, park service levels.

01:20:45 Speaker 14: Park service levels—that's been ongoing.

01:20:47 Speaker 14: We've been touching various services within that large group.

01:20:50 Speaker 14: This one will be horticulture.

01:20:52 Speaker 14: We have a winter maintenance review, and then also a service review summer report of what's been going on with service review over the past few years.

01:21:01 Speaker 14: Our corporate services committee, Thursday, September 10th.

01:21:04 Speaker 14: We have two reports scheduled right now: the reserve fund policy update and the 2025 financial audit.

01:21:11 Speaker 14: The community services committee is scheduled for Wednesday, September 23rd.

01:21:13 Speaker 14: September 23rd, we have an ice allocation policy.

01:21:17 Speaker 14: It's a kick-off report, community ambassador programme update, and the Owen Sound Minor Baseball Agreement.

01:21:24 Speaker 14: Our operations committee meets Thursday, September 24th.

01:21:27 Speaker 14: There's only one report right now scheduled for that: the water supply outside the municipal boundary.

01:21:33 Speaker 14: And then finally, in case you have missed it, there are opportunities through our media advisories throughout the month that are happening.

01:21:41 Speaker 14: These are from June 10th to July 19th.

01:21:45 Speaker 14: If you've missed any of that, owensound.ca/news.

01:21:49 Speaker 14: All of those media advisories are aggregated into this one place, so you can easily go to that one site, click on the links, and read about various happenings around the city.

01:21:59 Speaker 14: And then, lastly, we always invite everybody to stay connected.

01:22:02 Speaker 14: We have a number of websites: owensound.ca, the city's main website; ourcity.owensound.ca has planning information, surveys, etc.; reportaconcern.on.ca; and two other websites: owensoundriverdistrict.ca and owensoundtourism.ca.

01:22:20 Speaker 14: Both excellent locations to get calendar of events and things going on in the downtown and around the city in general.

01:22:26 Speaker 14: That concludes my report, Mayor.

01:22:28 Speaker 14: Thanks.

01:22:28 Speaker 14: Any questions?

01:22:30 Speaker 14: Seeing none.

01:22:31 Speaker 09: Move to number eight on our agenda: public forum.

01:22:37 Speaker 09: Anyone wish to take the microphone?

01:22:40 Speaker 09: André, just before you go, you're campaigning.

01:22:45 Speaker 09: This is not the opportunity to campaign.

01:22:48 Speaker 09: The rest of us have got rules that we're not to use public city facilities for campaigning.

01:22:57 Speaker 09: We didn't see you before there was an election.

01:22:59 Speaker 09: Now you're here every meeting.

01:23:01 Speaker 09: Go ahead.

01:23:05 Speaker 09: Andrii Zvorygin from OSHaRE.

01:23:07 Speaker 17: Thank you for the work that went into that pilot.

01:23:09 Speaker 17: It showed that civilian responders can provide useful help in low-risk situations, where police powers are unnecessary.

01:23:16 Speaker 17: The weakness was the structure.

01:23:18 Speaker 17: The five-month pilot cost $160,000, with a large share going to administration.

01:23:23 Speaker 17: It operated mainly as an added outreach service, and it didn't clearly measure how many police calls or officer hours were actually avoided.

01:23:30 Speaker 17: Council could consider a leaner 12-week pilot using part-time responders, existing supervision, and direct referrals through Ontario's emergency communication centre, that could lower administrative costs while sending suitable mental health, wellness,

01:23:43 Speaker 17: and de-escalation calls to less expensive civilian responders.

01:23:47 Speaker 17: Residents could receive faster and more appropriate help while police remain focused on crime and emergencies.

01:23:53 Speaker 17: By measuring police hours avoided and applying zero-based budgeting, council could determine whether the programme can reduce overtime, avoid future hiring, and help bring police costs under control.

01:24:03 Speaker 17: And I just want to be of the greatest service I can in whatever endeavor I'm involved in.

01:24:10 Speaker 17: I love you all unconditionally.

01:24:14 Speaker 17: Thank you for your time.

01:24:15 Speaker 17: It's campaigning.

01:24:16 Speaker 17: Thank you.

01:24:18 Speaker 17: Anyone else?

01:24:18 Speaker 17: Richard?

01:24:22 Speaker 17: Is anyone else who wished to speak to the microphone?

01:24:28 Speaker 09: I'm Ann Finley Stewart.

01:24:30 Speaker 09: I live in Owen Sound, and I have two things to say.

01:24:32 Speaker 09: First is that in 2016... first is that in 2007 I was on the founding board of Safe and Sound, so anybody thinks this is a new problem.

01:24:39 Speaker 18: We had it then because the Salvation Army men's shelter closed, and we were determined that people would not freeze to death on the street, and that's where Safe and Sound began.

01:24:48 Speaker 18: That's number one.

01:24:49 Speaker 18: Number two... yeah, and they didn't all come from everywhere else.

01:24:54 Speaker 18: They were our boys, and we had—we still have nothing for men.

01:24:59 Speaker 18: But number two was about I know you've taken a lot of grief on social media, and I don't intend to pile on there about the litter and the garbage and the public receptacles.

01:25:11 Speaker 18: But I do have a question that I haven't been able to find an answer to yet, and that is: when I pick up garbage that is identifiable,

01:25:18 Speaker 18: when I'm picking up litter and there's something with somebody's name on it—which I do all the time—things blow out of people's recycling and they have their names on them.

01:25:25 Speaker 18: I've picked up pill bottles, prescriptions, envelopes, packages, all kinds of things, and I don't want to pay to get rid of them, so I put them in a public garbage bin.

01:25:34 Speaker 18: Am I in fact causing a problem for somebody else?

01:25:38 Speaker 18: Am I by putting that back in the garbage that I found on the street?

01:25:44 Speaker 18: Am I guilty of the $100 infraction, or have I actually caused somebody else to have a problem?

01:25:52 Speaker 18: I didn't steal that box out of the woman's recycling, but I just want...

01:25:55 Speaker 18: I just want to know if—if I throw these things out—who is actually responsible?

01:26:01 Speaker 18: I would suspect that the bylaw would do an investigation and determine what they can determine based on the evidence that they collect.

01:26:11 Speaker 09: So I could be responsible for throwing garbage into a public receptacle that belonged to somebody else because I did it.

01:26:19 Speaker 18: And number two, they could be responsible because I did it.

01:26:24 Speaker 18: That would—that be accurate?

01:26:26 Speaker 18: You would potentially be part of the evidence, wouldn't you?

01:26:28 Speaker 09: Your statement would be part of the evidence.

01:26:30 Speaker 09: Yeah.

01:26:31 Speaker 18: So, I think the bylaw needs to be revisited.

01:26:33 Speaker 18: That's all.

01:26:36 Speaker 18: Thank you.

01:26:38 Speaker 18: Number nine: Correspondents received direction of council was required.

01:26:42 Speaker 01: Correspondents from the Chief Librarian, CEO, owensound.ca and North Grey Union Public Library, with regard to a five-year review of the 2022 to 2031 agreement.

01:26:52 Speaker 01: Go to you, Briana.

01:26:55 Speaker 01: Through your worship, the public library agreement is for a period of ten years.

01:27:03 Speaker 01: It began in 2022 and goes until 2031.

01:27:06 Speaker 04: Now that it is halfway through the agreement, the library is hosting a review meeting on Thursday, September 10, at seven p.m. in the library auditorium.

01:27:13 Speaker 04: They are requesting that representatives from each member municipality attend the meeting and are looking for the names of those who will be attending.

01:27:20 Speaker 04: Up on the screen is a draft motion directing staff to notify the library of the Owen Sound attendees.

01:27:23 Speaker 04: Go ahead, sound attendees?

01:27:25 Speaker 04: We just need the names of the council members to add to the motion.

01:27:28 Speaker 04: I will note that this meeting is on the same evening as the Corporate Services Committee meeting, and we need to make sure there isn't a quorum of Council that attends the Library meeting.

01:27:37 Speaker 04: With that, I will let Council discuss who is able to attend the meeting on the 10th and move the motion on the screen.

01:27:44 Speaker 04: Who wishes to attend?

01:27:46 Speaker 04: Councillor Kepes put her hand up.

01:27:48 Speaker 04: Anyone else?

01:27:50 Speaker 04: Yeah.

01:27:50 Speaker 04: No. It appears to be Councillor Koepke.

01:27:56 Speaker 04: I can attend.

01:28:01 Speaker 04: I only had a question pertaining to the lame duck period.

01:28:05 Speaker 11: If that has any impact whatsoever, through your worship, councillors are able to attend this type of meeting during lame duck.

01:28:20 Speaker 11: Okay, so, Councillor Kepes said yes.

01:28:24 Speaker 09: Deputy Mayor Greig has said yes.

01:28:25 Speaker 09: Is anyone else?

01:28:27 Speaker 09: Councillor Farmer has said yes.

01:28:31 Speaker 09: Oh, just let me finish.

01:28:32 Speaker 09: Then, anyone else?

01:28:35 Speaker 09: No, no. I'll move that, in consideration of correspondence received July 27th, 2026, from the Owen Sound and North Grey Union Public Library Chief Librarian/CEO, respecting a five-year review of the 2022 to 2031 OSNGUPL agreement.

01:28:51 Speaker 12: City Council directs staff to notify the OSNGUPL that Councillors Kepes and Deputy Mayor Greig will attend the review meeting on behalf of the city.

01:28:59 Speaker 12: And thank you.

01:29:00 Speaker 12: All in favour?

01:29:01 Speaker 12: And that is carried.

01:29:04 Speaker 12: Thanks, Brianna.

01:29:06 Speaker 12: Number ten reports from city staff.

01:29:09 Speaker 01: At 10a, a report from Ms. Coulter with regard to the zoning bylaw amendment, which I think we just heard a while ago.

01:29:18 Speaker 01: Thank you, Worship.

01:29:19 Speaker 19: As required by the Planning Act, zoning amendments must conform with the provincial planning statement and consider the goals, objectives, and policies of the city's official plan, and also land use compatibility.

01:29:30 Speaker 19: The technical report describes for Council and the community the subject property, the proposed amendment to permit the semi-detached dwelling,

01:29:39 Speaker 19: and really outlines the policies of the PPS and the official plan that will be relevant to Council's consideration of the matter when the recommendation report comes forward.

01:29:50 Speaker 19: The recommendation is that Council would just continue to process the application in accordance with the Planning Act.

01:29:57 Speaker 19: Questions?

01:29:58 Speaker 19: Motions?

01:29:59 Speaker 19: Travis.

01:30:00 Speaker 19: Thank you, Your Worship.

01:30:00 Speaker 19: I'd move the recommendation.

01:30:03 Speaker 19: Marian.

01:30:04 Speaker 19: I'd just like to make a comment, Your Worship.

01:30:07 Speaker 19: This is likely the last time I'll have an opportunity to publicly thank the developer for all the work that he does around Owen Sound in cleaning up buildings and making them more presentable,

01:30:18 Speaker 20: and it's certainly appreciated.

01:30:22 Speaker 20: Okay, any other comments?

01:30:24 Speaker 20: Seeing none, I call the question on favour.

01:30:27 Speaker 01: That is carried. 10b, a report from the Manager of Public Works and Engineering with regard to Grey County Urban Road Transfer update.

01:30:37 Speaker 01: There you are.

01:30:43 Speaker 01: Good evening, Mayor and Council.

01:30:48 Speaker 01: Our first... my first report this evening is the Grey County Urban Road Transfer update.

01:30:55 Speaker 01: A consideration of staff report OP-2604-1 respecting the update on the Grey County Road Urban Transfer.

01:31:01 Speaker 21: The City Council received this report for information.

01:31:04 Speaker 21: So this is following Staff's report we brought forward at the Special Council meeting on March 2nd, just with some updates.

01:31:11 Speaker 21: Excuse me...

01:31:12 Speaker 21: On where the county task force and county council have gone.

01:31:20 Speaker 21: Grey County Council Committee of the Whole passed a motion for the enhanced Version B framework on June 25th of this year.

01:31:28 Speaker 21: Later motion being adopted and approved the minutes at the July 9th meeting.

01:31:33 Speaker 21: Version B, what this means for the city: So this is an effective transfer date of June 1st, two thousand twenty-seven.

01:31:41 Speaker 21: We have a ten-year transitional funding model that we're moving through, including five years of declining operational funding, minor traffic signal funding, development charge transfers, and a commitment to share data relevant to the transfer.

01:31:58 Speaker 21: So the financial supports outlined in Version B break down generally to $11.26 million in transitional funding over the 10-year period; $3.3 million in development charge transfers one-time;

01:32:15 Speaker 21: $231,000 paid over five years to help offset winter maintenance and other operational costs; $183,000 over five years to help with traffic light costs; and a $269,000 one-time cost for capital projects,

01:32:36 Speaker 21: which could be included in Harrison Park Hill, as we all know needs some work.

01:32:42 Speaker 21: Staff will begin to work on a transitional work plan.

01:32:45 Speaker 21: Some of the key items that we'll be reviewing here in the next several months are: review and negotiate the transfer agreements; complete an assessment and final financial due diligence for the assets we'll be collecting;

01:32:56 Speaker 21: undertake a service delivery review; update our 2027 budget and long-term capital plan; review the impacts of our 2027 and ongoing operating budget; review existing contracts and service agreements we have with third-party vendors;

01:33:10 Speaker 21: update asset management lifecycle planning, and return back to Council with further updates.

01:33:16 Speaker 21: I think that's the best I could do for a highlight through this.

01:33:21 Speaker 21: If you have any questions, be happy to answer them.

01:33:24 Speaker 21: Okay, are there any questions?

01:33:25 Speaker 21: Councillor Farmer?

01:33:27 Speaker 21: Through the Mayor... two questions.

01:33:28 Speaker 21: One: initially when we spoke about this, there were concerns about the quality of the data for each of the assets that we were receiving from the county; where are staff now at a scale?

01:33:41 Speaker 12: Still really worried to be super confident you've got all the information you need, and will you get it all the way to the end before we own these things?

01:33:51 Speaker 12: The gap is definitely narrowing.

01:33:53 Speaker 21: We have received a little bit more information, and the County continues to commit to getting us everything we need prior to the transfer date next year.

01:34:02 Speaker 21: And a separate question: To what extent does ownership over these roads and traffic signals make it possible for us to update signalization and movement patterns to improve walkability or traffic flow?

01:34:14 Speaker 03: And how soon can we start to do that?

01:34:19 Speaker 03: Great question, thank you, Mayor.

01:34:21 Speaker 21: Currently there is a combined traffic timing and signal plan for all lights in Old Town, including the County ones.

01:34:27 Speaker 21: So we'll have a negligible impact by owning these lights rather than just helping with the operation of them.

01:34:35 Speaker 21: Good for you, John.

01:34:36 Speaker 21: Yep.

01:34:37 Speaker 21: Yep.

01:34:37 Speaker 21: Okay, Carol...

01:34:38 Speaker 21: Councillor Merton.

01:34:40 Speaker 21: Through you, Mayor: We've heard that currently staff have huge workloads.

01:34:49 Speaker 02: When I look at this report and all of the work that's entailed, I have to ask the question: How can this amount of workload be absorbed as an additional load on staff?

01:35:01 Speaker 02: It looks like a project; is there a project lead who will take this forward and coordinate everything because this is a lot of work for staff that are already carrying heavy workloads.

01:35:17 Speaker 02: So I'm not sure if you can answer that, or if I should look to my left to the City Manager.

01:35:26 Speaker 02: Through you, Mayor... to Councillor Merton: You are always cognizant of workload with Staff.

01:35:30 Speaker 14: This is a major project; Mason and team have taken the lead on it—I guess officially, unofficially however you'd want to look at it.

01:35:40 Speaker 14: We have had conversations about the quantity of work that's going to be required between now and when the agreements come forward,

01:35:47 Speaker 14: and staff are looking at other elements of what projects are on their plate etc. Some things through future updates might come back to say something has been delayed a few months depending on how the

01:36:00 Speaker 14: flow of information comes in;

01:36:01 Speaker 14: and that's one of the things we can't really put our finger on.

01:36:04 Speaker 14: It's not as if we have a basket of information today to start working with.

01:36:07 Speaker 14: So as the information flows in, it'll take priority or precedent as needed as we move forward.

01:36:14 Speaker 14: And there might be small amounts of work surge time involved with this project, and then it will ease back a little bit, and then another work surge.

01:36:21 Speaker 14: But we're trying to manage that.

01:36:24 Speaker 14: as best as possible.

01:36:26 Speaker 14: Okay, looking this way.

01:36:28 Speaker 14: Go ahead.

01:36:29 Speaker 14: Just a quick question, and I could ask it now or in the multi-year capital plan.

01:36:33 Speaker 11: But in two thousand twenty-seven, there's a six hundred twenty thousand dollars line item for Second Avenue West from Ten Street North to Fourteenth Street.

01:36:42 Speaker 11: How are you incorporating that project into this, into the agreement, and aligning it with the fact that Fourth Avenue West is going to be under reconstruction the whole year,

01:36:55 Speaker 11: in terms of projecting for traffic patterns and what's doable, because that would seem to be a real outlier that that project there on our plans.

01:37:07 Speaker 11: You're correct.

01:37:08 Speaker 21: That number was carried in our budget as prior to a commitment we made through the development process with the former BCK property.

01:37:18 Speaker 21: We will have to look into that and how we're best going to achieve that.

01:37:21 Speaker 21: Now that that'll be a city primary project, instead of being led by the county, and I think those are things we'll have to answer back to council on.

01:37:30 Speaker 21: Okay, I think I need a motion.

01:37:34 Speaker 21: Councillor Middlebrock, I'll move the recommendation to receive.

01:37:40 Speaker 21: Okay, any questions?

01:37:42 Speaker 21: Covered them all.

01:37:43 Speaker 09: I'll call the question.

01:37:44 Speaker 09: All in favour?

01:37:46 Speaker 09: That is carried.

01:37:48 Speaker 09: Don't go away, Mason.

01:37:49 Speaker 09: Next report: Public Works and Engineering.

01:37:52 Speaker 09: Superior Street Water Main Replacement.

01:37:57 Speaker 09: Thank you, Mayor.

01:37:58 Speaker 09: So my next report here is that, in consideration of Staff Report OP 26040 respecting the Superior Street Water Main Replacement Project, City Council approve project budget increase of seventy-five thousand, including nonrefundable HST,

01:38:12 Speaker 21: and authorise the Purchasing Agent to execute contract change orders for the replacement of water main from the current limits of the Ninth Avenue Rehabilitation Project to the new water main completed during the Sixth Street

01:38:23 Speaker 21: East Phase Two Water Main Looping Project.

01:38:27 Speaker 21: So this section of Superior Street has 190 metres of aging cast iron.

01:38:33 Speaker 21: That is a history of breaks.

01:38:35 Speaker 21: Our water team has a history of having to deal with numerous issues on that, between breaks and flow issues.

01:38:42 Speaker 21: This work was originally included in the Ninth Avenue rehabilitation scope.

01:38:47 Speaker 21: It was removed by staff and the consultant as we are.

01:38:48 Speaker 21: Staff and the consultant, as we were concerned by budget constraints at the time, and we wanted to have a healthy contingency to be able to complete all the work on Ninth Avenue.

01:38:59 Speaker 21: Pricing for Ninth Avenue came in competitive, and we have a healthy contingency moving forward.

01:39:05 Speaker 21: So we would like to change the scope back and to include this work.

01:39:11 Speaker 21: As of last Friday, the project has approximately four hundred and eighty thousand remaining in our contingency of the original 530 contingency allowance.

01:39:21 Speaker 21: We have approximately 125,600 anticipated extra costs currently on the books that have not currently come through in change orders.

01:39:30 Speaker 21: These are predominantly due to the increase in AEC for asphalt.

01:39:37 Speaker 21: So, based on OPS 100, if the price of asphalt spent goes up, the cost goes up per unit price.

01:39:44 Speaker 21: So Per the unit price, so that's where a lot of those extras will be borne.

01:39:48 Speaker 21: Currently, the quote we have from E.C. King to complete the work is three hundred sixteen thousand.

01:39:54 Speaker 21: That will include contract administration services by Tatum Engineering, bring into a total estimate of four hundred forty-two thousand.

01:40:02 Speaker 21: So well within the remaining budget we have left within the project.

01:40:06 Speaker 21: Staff have asked we include a seventy-five thousand dollars contingency fee, funded from the water reserve, just to ensure that if any other incidentals come up,

01:40:13 Speaker 21: we'll fund If other incidentals come up while finishing the project, we will be in good shape.

01:40:18 Speaker 21: I'm happy to answer any questions if anyone has any.

01:40:21 Speaker 21: Councillor Farmer.

01:40:23 Speaker 21: Through the mayor, I'd like to put the motion on the floor.

01:40:25 Speaker 21: I think it makes sense if we have an opportunity to remove a known liability while we have contractors mobilized to the site.

01:40:32 Speaker 12: It's an example to me of appropriate spending.

01:40:34 Speaker 12: Isn't just like spending the smallest amount.

01:40:37 Speaker 12: It's also spending money that gives you the biggest return over the longest period, and maybe it'll even save us money in cathodic protection costs.

01:40:45 Speaker 12: Thank you.

01:40:45 Speaker 12: Any other comments, Councillor Deputy Mayor Greig?

01:40:48 Speaker 12: Two questions, or yeah, two questions.

01:40:50 Speaker 11: Couldn't disagree whatsoever with those comments.

01:40:53 Speaker 11: Questions being, the additional engineering and geotechnical costs estimated at almost 55,000 are a little outside of the standard 10 to 15 percent.

01:41:04 Speaker 11: So, is there additional complexities here that we should be aware of as to why we're budgeting that much additional for engineering?

01:41:12 Speaker 11: And part two is instead of funding it all from water reserves, because we are upsizing the water line from its existing 15 centimeter,

01:41:23 Speaker 11: do we get an opportunity to apply any DCS to that growth that we're building up to?

01:41:32 Speaker 11: Through your mayor, I'll answer the engineering question first, and then I'll defer over.

01:41:37 Speaker 21: So in this section, we are anticipating encountering bedrock, so thus the geotechnical, which has increased the cost for that section greater than the ten to fifteen percent like you'd expect.

01:41:47 Speaker 21: So we're going to have to do some due diligence to find out where we're going to hit the rock,

01:41:51 Speaker 21: and then there's some bedding and insulation requirements that we're going to be looking into as we move forward.

01:41:57 Speaker 21: But should be well captured in that cost.

01:42:01 Speaker 21: Over to Kate.

01:42:03 Speaker 21: Through your worship, I don't have the balance of the water DC reserve in front of me to verify what's available, but however,

01:42:09 Speaker 22: Ninth Ave East and Superior Street were already contemplated to utilise development charges funding.

01:42:16 Speaker 22: So certainly, if this portion is suitable, we can draw a little bit extra for that, provided there are funds in the reserve for that.

01:42:24 Speaker 22: Okay.

01:42:27 Speaker 22: Does that need to be an amendment and a motion, or you've got that flexibility?

01:42:30 Speaker 11: Okay, be great to use it if we have it, and we're upsizing, so.

01:42:35 Speaker 11: This sounds indicating that yes, there's flexibility.

01:42:37 Speaker 09: We don't need a motion.

01:42:38 Speaker 09: It was off microphone.

01:42:40 Speaker 09: Okay, I need someone to move the motion.

01:42:44 Speaker 09: Oh, John did already.

01:42:46 Speaker 09: Okay, all in favour?

01:42:48 Speaker 09: That's carried.

01:42:49 Speaker 09: Thanks.

01:42:51 Speaker 09: Next, Manager of Corporate Services on some Police Services Facility Needs Assessment.

01:42:59 Speaker 09: Hi, Jason.

01:42:59 Speaker 09: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, members of Council.

01:43:06 Speaker 09: Tonight, I'm presenting Report CR Two Six Zero Seven One, which is a request to authorise a comprehensive facility space needs assessment and business case for the Owen Sound Police Service Building.

01:43:17 Speaker 23: Under the Community Safety and Policing Act, the municipality is legislatively responsible for providing and maintaining adequate police facilities.

01:43:26 Speaker 23: This report is the next step in meeting that responsibility.

01:43:30 Speaker 23: Back in two thousand and twenty-three, a facility condition audit by McIntosh Perry gave us a good look at the physical building deficiencies, like our upcoming $1.6 million air handling unit replacement,

01:43:41 Speaker 23: and other capital maintenance items in the multi-year capital plan.

01:43:44 Speaker 23: However, that previous audit only looked at physical condition.

01:43:48 Speaker 23: It did not evaluate whether the facility actually continues to meet the modern operational, staffing, legislative accessibility, and service delivery requirements of our police services.

01:43:59 Speaker 23: The Police Service Board requested this comprehensive review to answer that question.

01:44:04 Speaker 23: The study will provide us with an objective, common set of data to evaluate all our options, whether we are best served through refurbishment and expansion or a brand new purpose-built facility.

01:44:16 Speaker 23: Turning to the resource alignment and financial details, the estimated cost of the study is a hundred thousand dollars.

01:44:23 Speaker 23: Importantly, no additional tax levy funding is required.

01:44:29 Speaker 23: The budget will be fully funded through a combination of development charges, the police station facility reserve, and a one third funding contribution directly from the Oshawa Police Service Board revenue reserve.

01:44:41 Speaker 23: If Council approves the recommendations tonight, staff will prepare and issue a competitive request for proposal through our purchasing policy later this year.

01:44:51 Speaker 23: The project team, including the city manager, the chief of police, and the manager of corporate services, will oversee the consultant's work.

01:44:58 Speaker 23: We anticipate receiving the final report and business case early in the next term of council, ensuring that the newly elected council has the objective data and cost estimates they need to make an informed,

01:45:09 Speaker 23: long-term capital decisions.

01:45:12 Speaker 23: And I'll be happy to answer any questions council might have.

01:45:15 Speaker 23: Good, thank you.

01:45:16 Speaker 23: Questions, Councillor Capkey.

01:45:18 Speaker 23: Not a question, Your Worship.

01:45:19 Speaker 23: I'll move the recommendation.

01:45:22 Speaker 23: Okay.

01:45:23 Speaker 23: Comments, Deputy Mayor Greig.

01:45:27 Speaker 23: Well.

01:45:30 Speaker 23: I'll go first.

01:45:31 Speaker 11: I think back nine years, and I have the old OPP costing in front of me on the computer.

01:45:37 Speaker 11: That costing, I never recall reading a single paragraph about a new building being contemplated at all through the Oshawa Police Services, or if the OPP were to take over as part of their project.

01:45:53 Speaker 11: And I know early on, or when we had that meeting and we made that decision, I think there was hesitancy to move forward with the OPP costing because in the first couple years,

01:46:04 Speaker 11: we were absorbing some considerable costs on the building as it would have to be refurbished for certain elements of what the OPP required.

01:46:16 Speaker 11: But nowhere did I ever read the contemplation of a new police building.

01:46:23 Speaker 11: We cannot afford it.

01:46:23 Speaker 11: Not afford it.

01:46:25 Speaker 11: We have the multi-year capital budget coming up later.

01:46:28 Speaker 11: There's thirty-four just under thirty-four million dollars of unfunded in it.

01:46:32 Speaker 11: There is well, we haven't even got the urban road download all captured fully in terms of our long-term requirements.

01:46:41 Speaker 11: Now, we are one of the highest tax communities, and in relation to household average household incomes, it places us even worse provincially amongst our comparators.

01:46:58 Speaker 11: There, we have no ability to be able to absorb a place, a new building.

01:47:04 Speaker 11: So, I can't support the motion to expand another hundred thousand dollars.

01:47:09 Speaker 11: We do have certain reconstruction, refurbishment projects that are sprinkled through the multi-year capital plan.

01:47:17 Speaker 11: We have since it was moved into, and I think in 1999, maybe, was a date in one of the reports.

01:47:26 Speaker 11: It's ongoing.

01:47:27 Speaker 11: It needs to continue to be ongoing.

01:47:29 Speaker 11: We just had that 2023 study, and I cannot support another hundred thousand dollars to provide us more information, potentially for a new building that we know municipally we cannot afford in our tax base anyway.

01:47:42 Speaker 11: So, I'm opposed to it.

01:47:45 Speaker 11: This this actual request even has me inquiring or wishing to inquire more so to align ourselves with Sarnia,

01:47:56 Speaker 11: who recently has just I think been public about their desire to look for an OPP costing once again because of the desire for a new police building in Sarnia that they also cannot afford in

01:48:07 Speaker 11: today's times.

01:48:13 Speaker 11: Councillor Farmer, thank you, through the mayor.

01:48:17 Speaker 12: My first instinct is to support the recommendation in the report.

01:48:20 Speaker 12: I think that if we've got funding from the reserves,

01:48:22 Speaker 12: if there's a one third opportunity for us to get to a place where we have a more robust set of data that says not just what's falling apart or mouldy that we need to fix,

01:48:34 Speaker 12: but also how does this fit for the long term, how does this facility help us to provide what is a legislated core service for the long term of this community that is growing?

01:48:46 Speaker 12: If we build every unit of the three thousand plus units that are somewhere in the development pipeline.

01:48:52 Speaker 12: We're going to have more people.

01:48:53 Speaker 12: We already hear routinely from the OSPs that they would appreciate having more people to provide more service.

01:49:03 Speaker 12: We certainly get letters to that effect from the police board,

01:49:06 Speaker 12: but I don't think that we've had enough opportunities to actively sort the apples and the oranges together in the data that we're talking about and the issues that we're assessing.

01:49:16 Speaker 12: Regardless of whether or not Owen Sound was being served by a municipal service or by the OPP,

01:49:23 Speaker 12: I think that the stresses of modern policing would mean that there are elements of a building that's older than me that might need to be updated or might no longer be sufficient.

01:49:34 Speaker 12: In my first year on council, I heard folks talking about just the problem with parking, like that there's a struggle for parking for staff.

01:49:42 Speaker 12: We've heard that again recently, and I don't feel like we currently have a common set of data to let us say what makes sense, and I would find that helpful.

01:49:56 Speaker 12: Councilmember, thank you.

01:50:00 Speaker 16: Pardon me.

01:50:02 Speaker 16: I'm with Councillor Deputy Mayor Greig on this one.

01:50:06 Speaker 16: The 100 needs assessment for me is a troubling amount of money to come up with a plan that we really feel like it's already heading towards the idea that we're going to build a new

01:50:24 Speaker 16: building because there's the parking constraints and all the different things we can't afford,

01:50:28 Speaker 16: it, we're already staring down almost five million dollars on a fire building upgrade.

01:50:34 Speaker 16: I question how much money in IT upgrades and equipment have been done over the past year and a bit for last year and a bit for the communication centre and the NG 911 in this

01:50:44 Speaker 16: building,

01:50:45 Speaker 16: and what in the world would it cost to move all of that if you're planning to either move to a different space or build something new?

01:50:54 Speaker 16: How much in capital projects do we have on the books that we've either just completed or going to be done in 2026, 2027?

01:51:01 Speaker 16: What happens with those?

01:51:02 Speaker 16: Are we moving forward with those while we're waiting for this hundred thousand dollar plan to come back and tell us that it doesn't even meet our needs.

01:51:12 Speaker 16: For me, I feel like costs are getting out of control.

01:51:17 Speaker 16: Between police and fire, we are sitting at about 16 million dollars.

01:51:21 Speaker 16: And people in the city are saying, Why are our services not being met?

01:51:26 Speaker 16: And why are our taxes so high?

01:51:27 Speaker 16: And why can't we do this?

01:51:28 Speaker 16: Why can't we do that?

01:51:29 Speaker 16: Because emergency services are costing 16 million dollars a year, and we don't have any more money to do anything else.

01:51:36 Speaker 16: And today, I was going through and looking at the other communities in Grey County.

01:51:43 Speaker 16: Out of all the communities in Grey County, most of them are OPP service.

01:51:47 Speaker 16: Georgian Bluffs OPP, one point five million.

01:51:49 Speaker 16: Gray Highlands OPP, one point eight five million.

01:51:52 Speaker 16: Blue Mountains OPP, three point four million.

01:51:54 Speaker 16: Southgate one point four million OPP.

01:51:57 Speaker 16: Chatsworth OPP.

01:51:58 Speaker 16: Mefford OPP.

01:51:59 Speaker 16: And we are nine point eight million dollars the police are costing.

01:52:06 Speaker 16: And then I was searching other communities.

01:52:09 Speaker 16: Out of all of the communities in Ontario, there are only about forty that have our own municipal force, and all of these other ones that have gone to OPP: Midland, five million dollars; Shelburne,

01:52:22 Speaker 16: one point six million; Collingwood, seven million dollars OPP.

01:52:26 Speaker 16: And these are similar communities, and that is after the big OPP increase of ten to twenty percent.

01:52:34 Speaker 16: That's what they're paying versus us at 9.8 million dollars.

01:52:38 Speaker 16: We need to do something.

01:52:39 Speaker 16: If we don't ask for an OPP costing, we are not doing justice to the citizens of Owen Sound, because if we can do the same job for less money than it deserves,

01:52:53 Speaker 16: us at least asking for the OPP costing.

01:52:55 Speaker 16: And I'm willing to put that on the floor as a motion.

01:53:00 Speaker 16: Currently on the floor is the recommendation, so you can't put that on the floor just yet, Councillor Martin.

01:53:08 Speaker 09: Through you, Mayor.

01:53:12 Speaker 09: We don't want to assume or jump to a bias around a new building or refurbished.

01:53:19 Speaker 02: This is a demonstration of a collaborative cost-sharing initiative that will give us information that will help in the future make an informed decision.

01:53:32 Speaker 02: It is tempting to jump to a conclusion, but I think it is perhaps too soon.

01:53:39 Speaker 02: So the advantage of moving through this process is that it does assist us in having information that forms the framework for looking at various options.

01:53:55 Speaker 02: There will be people who will want to jump to the conclusion: we should do it this way versus that way, municipal versus OPP.

01:54:04 Speaker 02: Having spent two hours in the last two weeks asking that question of our police board chair and our chief of police, so that I could understand better, it is more than a facility.

01:54:21 Speaker 02: It involves contract established contracts.

01:54:26 Speaker 02: There's a lot of costs.

01:54:28 Speaker 02: More than a facility should that be contemplated?

01:54:33 Speaker 02: This report would give us a framework to at least begin looking at what is the best direction.

01:54:42 Speaker 02: We can't make an informed decision by piecemeal bits of information, anecdotal or narrative information, or a perception.

01:54:52 Speaker 02: I support the motion, not just because I'm on the Police Services Board, but I think we need additional information to go forward.

01:55:05 Speaker 02: Who else wants to talk?

01:55:08 Speaker 02: Go ahead.

01:55:10 Speaker 02: Through you, Mayor.

01:55:11 Speaker 15: Just a few questions.

01:55:12 Speaker 15: I agree that if we like, obviously this is a planning investment, and you're not asking for the construction or the decision to construct a brand new building.

01:55:23 Speaker 15: But then, one hundred thousand dollars for a needs assessment; it's...

01:55:25 Speaker 15: Needs assessment, like it seems to me, like a lot of money, and if we are spending that to collect factual data, so a few months down the road, if we have the report back,

01:55:36 Speaker 15: so the outcome that you mentioned in the report is either a renovation, expansion, or a brand new building, but I don't think so.

01:55:44 Speaker 15: Like now, there is...

01:55:47 Speaker 15: I'm not clear.

01:55:48 Speaker 15: Like, do you have funds?

01:55:50 Speaker 15: Like, like we don't have funds, of course, but do you have an estimate on what it would cost?

01:55:55 Speaker 15: If we are going for the renovations, or if we are going for a brand new building, or if we are just expanding it into the neighbouring buildings.

01:56:03 Speaker 15: Like, is there an estimate number on that?

01:56:09 Speaker 15: Through you, Mayor.

01:56:10 Speaker 23: No, there isn't, and that's a big part of what this assessment will tell us: what the potential costs would be for those options.

01:56:21 Speaker 23: So, if we don't find funds... anyways.

01:56:24 Speaker 15: If we can't afford a brand new facility, so all these hundred thousand dollars are down the drain.

01:56:29 Speaker 15: So that's a waste, right?

01:56:36 Speaker 15: Through you, your mayor.

01:56:38 Speaker 23: I'm not sure it would be staff's opinion that that would be a waste; as I do feel,

01:56:43 Speaker 23: or the staff does feel that there is value in understanding what the best approach is for this facility.

01:56:54 Speaker 23: Councillor Dodd.

01:56:55 Speaker 23: Thank you, Your Worship.

01:56:56 Speaker 13: And maybe I'm just looking for some clarity because I heard what Councillor Merton had mentioned there.

01:57:02 Speaker 13: But let's not put the cart before the horse of getting to a conclusion without having something first.

01:57:08 Speaker 13: There was a previous... the minutes of a previous meeting noted that there was a conversation about striking a new building committee with the police board.

01:57:20 Speaker 13: So.

01:57:21 Speaker 13: If how does that fit into play?

01:57:24 Speaker 13: If there was a discussion on the board about having setting up a new building working group, but then not putting the cart before the horse, we're having a discussion here,

01:57:33 Speaker 13: but saying that we would look for facility space needs assessment.

01:57:36 Speaker 13: So, just need some clarity on how that goes together.

01:57:53 Speaker 13: The conversation prior in the minutes of police service was basically the facility needs.

01:58:04 Speaker 20: It was minuteed incorrectly to be a building searching for a new building or a building.

01:58:12 Speaker 20: The end results would be: we need to do something to meet our adequate standards.

01:58:17 Speaker 20: We need to do something to meet the legislation, and it was minuted as a building.

01:58:22 Speaker 20: It was never thought to be initially a building committee; it was to be a needs assessment committee because you have to start somewhere.

01:58:32 Speaker 20: I hope that helps.

01:58:38 Speaker 20: Councillor, I don't disagree with anything that's been said, but the one thing that I kind of keep coming back to: we have a building, we own a building, we talk about this all the time.

01:58:51 Speaker 10: I have no idea what the state of the building is, and I think we do need to know what we're dealing with and how we make it operate appropriately.

01:59:03 Speaker 10: To me, I don't think that I think it's a perfectly good building, but just probably needs some reorganization and some better use of space.

01:59:11 Speaker 10: But that's what this will, I think, prove in time.

01:59:18 Speaker 10: So right now there is a report.

01:59:20 Speaker 10: Maybe I'm looking at Kate.

01:59:21 Speaker 10: There is a report done a couple of years ago on what the building needs.

01:59:25 Speaker 10: Can you help explain that?

01:59:26 Speaker 10: Help me understand that.

01:59:33 Speaker 10: Yes, absolutely through Mayor.

01:59:37 Speaker 23: So in 2023, there was a building assessment audit done that identified critical upgrades or upgrades that needed to be done to that building,

01:59:48 Speaker 23: and so the biggest things that came out of that assessment were the air handling unit replacement, electrical system upgrades, exterior masonry repairs, elevator replacement, and windows and doors.

02:00:01 Speaker 23: That McIntosh Perry condition assessment came to a cumulative total of $6.4 million dollars.

02:00:08 Speaker 23: And do we have a plan right now that we're working on that $6.4 million dollars of upgrades?

02:00:15 Speaker 23: To Your Worship, not the entire $6.4 million dollars, but within the next five years of our multi-year capital plan, we have $2.7 million in projects that are slated to be worked on.

02:00:30 Speaker 23: Okay so the work is already being done Kate.

02:00:32 Speaker 09: And nothing you need to add to that.

02:00:36 Speaker 09: I don't think so other than to just confirm that that work is planned and it is funded; so we have money set aside to move forward with those projects,

02:00:43 Speaker 22: and we are moving forward with some pretty significant ones currently including an electrical upgrade which touches many facets of the building as well as the HVAC update.

02:00:54 Speaker 22: Thank you.

02:00:55 Speaker 22: So I was around when Mayor [was] mayor, I think, when we did the last OPP costing, and the OPP had a whole list of building changes that they needed that were going to be expensive,

02:01:14 Speaker 09: and we were told by the local police force that we would not need any of those changes.

02:01:18 Speaker 09: Now I recognize it's a number of years later but if you're going to be doing a new building or renovating building for one police service, I don't understand why you wouldn't want to.

02:01:30 Speaker 09: I'm asking my friends why you wouldn't look at before you take that step: look and see; do an OPP costing and see what they require.

02:01:42 Speaker 09: I was criticized at a police board meeting for being inaccurate.

02:01:47 Speaker 09: However we do have one of the most expensive police forces in the province per capita.

02:01:55 Speaker 09: So I'm relying on the BMA study, and it showed that we are number one or number two of municipalities our size; that went from 19 to 29,000 nine thousand people for the last five years.

02:02:08 Speaker 09: When you looked at all of them on the BMA study, we were in sixty-four or sixty-five municipalities.

02:02:17 Speaker 09: We were somewhere between twelfth and fourteenth out of forty-five [municipalities].

02:02:21 Speaker 09: Our total expenditure for the police is $15.5 million dollars; it's approximately nine or just under ten that is coming from taxpayers because there are other grants and things that are applied for.

02:02:37 Speaker 09: I look at Collingwood now: twenty-seven thousand people, very similar homeless problems yes crime problems yes very similar.

02:02:46 Speaker 09: They've got an OPP contract.

02:02:49 Speaker 09: Their contract for the OPP is under seven million;

02:02:52 Speaker 09: the cost of their building was I think they said one hundred thirty-three thousand might have been I think it was one hundred thirty-three thousand to operate their building plus some other costs to it.

02:03:04 Speaker 09: Our expenditures are twice as high.

02:03:06 Speaker 09: At some point you need to look after the taxpayers and go back and have a look and say where do we compare?

02:03:13 Speaker 09: Maybe OPP can't come in and compare; maybe they're out to lunch by now too.

02:03:18 Speaker 09: But if you don't ask, you're not going to know.

02:03:20 Speaker 09: I would from my point of view I would not move ahead with this study until you look at both police forces and see what they need and make a big decision amongst everybody.

02:03:34 Speaker 09: But go ahead through the Mayor to that point: is people are suggesting an OPP costing but are these two things at odds with each other or could they be parallel?

02:03:51 Speaker 09: If a costing is also going to require us to know how many people, how many offices, how many staff, how much parking,

02:03:58 Speaker 12: how many garages I don't know how many baths and half baths but like do we not need to know what this building will have space for?

02:04:10 Speaker 12: Check Councillor Hamley's comment and could those two things coexist?

02:04:15 Speaker 12: I think that's putting the cart before the horse because you don't know what one is going to require compared to the other.

02:04:21 Speaker 09: So that's why I think you want to find out what they both require.

02:04:24 Speaker 09: This is part of that decision making process before you go with through you Mayor.

02:04:28 Speaker 09: I'd like to suggest that we need to widen our lens if we're going to even engage in that type of dialogue.

02:04:41 Speaker 02: Right now we're talking about a building however around that is the wider lens that by contract we are will pay a price to break an existing contract;

02:04:57 Speaker 02: that is an add-on expense that needs to be factored in and there are other issues as well.

02:05:03 Speaker 02: So I think facilities are one component but not the main component.

02:05:10 Speaker 02: And should it's important to also recognize that there's equipment besides the facility itself that may factor in.

02:05:22 Speaker 02: Having a wider lens if we're going to engage in that dialogue is important because it may actually be that those ancillary costs run into millions of dollars to even consider a change.

02:05:36 Speaker 02: And I know that information could be made available should it be requested.

02:05:41 Speaker 02: Thank you.

02:05:42 Speaker 02: And that's the exact reason that you get that information and make a fair comparison looking at all the costs.

02:05:49 Speaker 02: Councillor Caput hopefully this is to wrap it up Your Worship first of all, the McIntosh Perry report was to assess a building not particularly a police service building and the needs of police service.

02:06:06 Speaker 20: This report that's being asked for or this assessment that's being asked for is to determine whether this particular building can accommodate the requirements under legislation etc of a police service.

02:06:21 Speaker 20: The other thing that I would comment on is there's quite a difference in community policing and OPP policing,

02:06:29 Speaker 20: and how they provide the service and how readily available they are to provide the services needed in our community.

02:06:38 Speaker 20: So I would just leave it at that.

02:06:41 Speaker 20: I'm going to take the bait; I'll respond to both those comments.

02:06:45 Speaker 09: It used to be an insurance company.

02:06:47 Speaker 09: The police board took it over.

02:06:49 Speaker 09: They had one floor.

02:06:50 Speaker 09: They expanded to two floors.

02:06:52 Speaker 09: There have been millions of dollars put into cells, expanding them to make that into a police building.

02:07:01 Speaker 09: So to suggest it's not a police building is incorrect; it has been renovated a couple times by the Police Services Board according to their recommendations to make it into a police building.

02:07:13 Speaker 09: And with regard to all the consequences of an OPP costing, that's certainly something that would come out and would be looked at at the time.

02:07:23 Speaker 09: If I can comment, I'm not disagreeing that it's not a police building and hasn't been for a long time.

02:07:28 Speaker 20: I'm just saying that Macintosh Perry didn't assess it for what the Police Services Board needs are at this time or in the future.

02:07:37 Speaker 20: Good; thank you.

02:07:37 Speaker 09: I'm going to call the question.

02:07:39 Speaker 09: So the motion was Councillor Koepke.

02:07:42 Speaker 09: It is in front of us: A recommendation.

02:07:46 Speaker 09: All in favour?

02:07:47 Speaker 09: One, two, three opposed.

02:07:50 Speaker 09: One, two, three, four, five, and me six.

02:07:55 Speaker 09: So what's next?

02:08:03 Speaker 09: Looking to the Clerk because it is a police-related matter.

02:08:08 Speaker 24: Am I good to make a motion on the City Manager bringing back a report in September?

02:08:15 Speaker 24: Sorry; on what is involved in going to an OPP costing?

02:08:25 Speaker 24: I would suggest, Mr. Simmonds, that we ask staff to bring back a report of what is required and even possible if no OPP costing occurs.

02:08:39 Speaker 09: Does that make sense?

02:08:40 Speaker 09: Through you, Mayor.

02:08:44 Speaker 14: Hearing the proposed motion and the update for clarity,

02:08:48 Speaker 14: I think what I'm hearing is you would like for staff to come back in September with an update to Council on what goes into an OPP costing, what is involved with that,

02:08:59 Speaker 14: and what are the steps.

02:09:00 Speaker 14: Because I know my most recent memory of an OPP costing is Orangeville, and I know the Solicitor General has taken over some aspects regarding municipalities asking for OPP costings,

02:09:11 Speaker 14: etc. So probably my work between now and September would be to at least have an informational meeting with the Solicitor General's office to understand what goes into it—not initiate one, not undertake one,

02:09:23 Speaker 14: and not spend any money on one—but just find out what those steps are and bring that back to Council to inform your decision-making as you move forward.

02:09:32 Speaker 14: If does that sound right?

02:09:36 Speaker 14: Yes; I'm happy with that.

02:09:38 Speaker 25: Ms. Bloomfield, if that is the request, do we need to wait?

02:09:41 Speaker 25: Do we need to waive notice because we're asking for a report to come back?

02:09:49 Speaker 09: Through you, Your Worship, I would suggest that since a report would be coming back and no final decisions are being made—and it does relate to this police matter—this could be done as a simple motion.

02:10:01 Speaker 04: But of course, if Council wants to do a point of order, they have the right to do so.

02:10:20 Speaker 04: Thanks; through the Mayor, I'm happy to support that request for information.

02:10:23 Speaker 12: I think that it's worth saying on one hand that the Owen Sound Police Service and its officers provide really dedicated service and care to our community.

02:10:32 Speaker 12: And if we're looking at this as a structural problem, unfortunately, this goes back to the issue of police funding at the provincial level;

02:10:40 Speaker 12: the cost of municipal policing is not being offset by provincial funding in the way OPP services are.

02:10:47 Speaker 12: At a basic level, we've got to figure out how to provide the service for a reasonable cost.

02:10:53 Speaker 12: And freeing up that kind of budget would also let us do things like support the type of project we heard about at the start of the meeting tonight:

02:11:01 Speaker 12: get upstream and help take care of each other so that we aren't in a place where police need to be involved for matters they don't need to address.

02:11:10 Speaker 12: So I'm really happy to support the request for that report, acknowledging that it's probably really complicated.

02:11:18 Speaker 12: Okay; anyone else?

02:11:19 Speaker 12: Councillor Mettler?

02:11:27 Speaker 12: Thank you.

02:11:29 Speaker 12: Thank you for those comments, and I also want to reiterate that in no way is this anything about the service we receive from our Owen Sound Police Force—they are a very, very dedicated police force,

02:11:44 Speaker 16: and they do a fantastic job with the challenges they face on a daily basis.

02:11:49 Speaker 16: And I thank them for their service.

02:11:53 Speaker 16: This is not anything to do with being unhappy with the way it is performed; it is strictly a budgetary matter,

02:12:03 Speaker 16: and it makes fiscal common sense to ask for an OPP costing when you look at the numbers of what other jurisdictions are paying versus what we are paying.

02:12:13 Speaker 16: That is simply what I'm asking for: just to find out more about the OPP costing for fiscal common sense.

02:12:24 Speaker 16: Thank you.

02:12:25 Speaker 16: I'm going to call the question.

02:12:25 Speaker 16: All in favour?

02:12:27 Speaker 16: One, two, three, four, five, and I'm six.

02:12:30 Speaker 01: So it's three opposed; three opposed.

02:12:32 Speaker 01: So that carries.

02:12:35 Speaker 01: Thank you.

02:12:35 Speaker 01: Next is 10E: we're going back to Mason regarding an engineering technology service agreement for offsite improvements to support a U-Haul site plan.

02:12:50 Speaker 01: Thank you; through your Mayor.

02:12:53 Speaker 21: So this report—in consideration of staff report OP26038—respects the servicing agreement between U-Haul and the City of Owen Sound, formerly known as The City of Owensville,

02:13:02 Speaker 21: at 16th Avenue East for Council Direct Staff to bring forward a ballot authorising the Mayor and Clerk to execute a servicing agreement.

02:13:10 Speaker 21: So this is at the intersection of 16th Street East and 20th Avenue.

02:13:16 Speaker 21: The U-Haul property is the last property in that corner to develop out, which has been done through a host of covenants and agreements dating back to 2011/2012.

02:13:31 Speaker 21: This property received conditional site plan approval in the fall of two thousand and twenty-five.

02:13:36 Speaker 21: As part of that site plan approval—or rather, as per the conditions—applicants are required to enter into a servicing agreement with the City of Owen Sound to construct necessary off-site improvements,

02:13:48 Speaker 21: which here include upgrades to the lights at Sixteenth and Twentieth Avenues, and upgrades to 20th Avenue East between Sixteenth and Seventeenth.

02:13:58 Speaker 21: This report is being brought to Council because there is potential for CD-2 to front-end a cost of $74,000 in twenty thirty-two.

02:14:09 Speaker 21: Should future development not take place within that time frame, our Development Officer Matt has provided a wealth of background over the last fifteen years in the latter half of the report.

02:14:21 Speaker 21: And I may look to the Directors to help me answer any questions you have; but at this point, I'll take questions.

02:14:27 Speaker 21: Councillor Deputy Mayor Craig: A couple of questions to begin with.

02:14:34 Speaker 11: Those two pins—one is 19th/17th Street—and the adjoining property located to the west of it.

02:14:41 Speaker 11: How are those two properties zoned?

02:14:42 Speaker 11: I could look that up and will do so; but I think they're designated E-City Commercial, but still zoned M-Commercial or M1.

02:14:55 Speaker 11: But I will check that, and I'll come back if I'm wrong.

02:15:01 Speaker 11: My problem here is that paragraph that states if no development of the benefiting lands occurs before 2032, the city will provide payment to U-Haul, on or after May 1, in the amount of seventy-four thousand,

02:15:14 Speaker 11: and change.

02:15:15 Speaker 11: I'm not in favour of leaving the taxpayer on the hook for that seventy-four thousand and change.

02:15:21 Speaker 11: I think when you go into developing these lands, acknowledging the types of responsibilities and obligations financially that exist.

02:15:32 Speaker 11: Even those properties, if and when they develop on 17th Street, may have a substantial requirement to financially compensate the city to build up 17th Street or the 17th Street East Extension,

02:15:49 Speaker 11: which right now is effectively a cycling path.

02:15:53 Speaker 11: So that's the part here I can't agree with: leaving the taxpayers exposed to seventy-five thousand.

02:16:01 Speaker 11: Five years goes by in the blink of an eye.

02:16:05 Speaker 11: The economy turns a little bit, and then we are on the hook for seventy-four thousand three hundred thirty-two dollars.

02:16:12 Speaker 11: That I can't support.

02:16:14 Speaker 11: I think the developers knowingly going into these developments with certain expectations of development financial requirements.

02:16:26 Speaker 11: I'm going to go to Laura.

02:16:29 Speaker 11: Thank you, Worship.

02:16:31 Speaker 26: I just wanted to make sure that we all have the same understanding.

02:16:37 Speaker 26: The cost impact the city would be a temporary one.

02:16:42 Speaker 26: The intention is that we would reimburse the current developer at that point, and then continue to endeavor to recover those funds when that property does develop in the future.

02:16:56 Speaker 26: It's just to have a break point, so that the existing developer isn't waiting, say, twenty-five years or something, to be reimbursed those fees.

02:17:10 Speaker 26: So will they still have certain financial obligations though, to the future development of Seventeen Street, which exists right in front of them right now and is...

02:17:17 Speaker 11: a terrible road in terrible state?

02:17:22 Speaker 11: Through your Worship, to Deputy Mayor Greig: yes, that's the intention.

02:17:26 Speaker 26: That debt wouldn't disappear.

02:17:29 Speaker 26: Those properties would still owe that money.

02:17:31 Speaker 26: It's just that they would owe the city that money.

02:17:33 Speaker 26: It wouldn't be conveyed on to the developer because...

02:17:38 Speaker 26: If it doesn't develop until after that point, they would have already been paid back.

02:17:44 Speaker 26: Got it?

02:17:44 Speaker 26: Good.

02:17:45 Speaker 09: We were good.

02:17:46 Speaker 09: We ran into this.

02:17:47 Speaker 09: We are still running into this with Heritage Grove, where it was left open-ended, and that's been 15 years.

02:17:58 Speaker 09: So the idea is that you want to develop it quickly.

02:18:01 Speaker 09: Get the other piece of property's share of it being carried or front-ended by the developer.

02:18:13 Speaker 09: If we aren't able to collect from those others, we would step in, put the money up, and then we would collect from those other developers for their share.

02:18:21 Speaker 09: I don't know if that still makes sense, or if I got it more confused.

02:18:23 Speaker 09: But I think I got it more confused.

02:18:27 Speaker 09: There's a recommendation there.

02:18:35 Speaker 09: I'm confused every day, so I'll move that recommendation.

02:18:39 Speaker 13: But not always by me.

02:18:43 Speaker 13: Okay?

02:18:43 Speaker 13: Any questions?

02:18:45 Speaker 13: Call the question.

02:18:45 Speaker 13: All in favour?

02:18:47 Speaker 13: That is carried.

02:18:49 Speaker 13: Thank you, Mason.

02:18:51 Speaker 09: Next: 10F Report from Deputy Mayor from Grey County Council.

02:18:57 Speaker 09: This time it loaded on my machine the way it should.

02:19:02 Speaker 09: Last week, Council approved a $1.4 million dollar contract with Community Living Owen Sound to provide annual special needs resourcing services across the county.

02:19:10 Speaker 11: The programme is funded by the province in accordance with early learning and childcare guidelines.

02:19:14 Speaker 11: The single provider third-party delivery model seeks to improve service coordination, access, efficiency, accountability, and quality of service across the county.

02:19:23 Speaker 11: Council determined to debenture two new paramedic bases in Durham and Feversham over fifteen years, increasing the payment next year by forty-four thousand dollars, however saving over seven hundred thousand dollars in mortgage term interest costs.

02:19:37 Speaker 11: This returns debt onto the county books after remaining debenture payments were paid off at the start of 2026.

02:19:43 Speaker 11: And council had an update from the Grey Bruce Ontario Health Team in the form of a deputation, with the goal of attaching twenty-three thousand five hundred residents to a primary care provider by 2029,

02:19:57 Speaker 11: with seven million dollars in enhanced base funding received since last August, and hopeful of a further four million dollars supporting plans.

02:20:04 Speaker 11: The hope is to attach a further nine thousand residents with a primary provider by early 2026...

02:20:08 Speaker 11: Provider by early 2027?

02:20:10 Speaker 11: I welcome any questions and ask for Council's endorsement of the verbal report.

02:20:14 Speaker 11: Any questions, Councillor Fern?

02:20:17 Speaker 11: Thank you.

02:20:18 Speaker 11: Through the Mayor: the Ontario Health Team update.

02:20:22 Speaker 11: We've heard a lot about how expanding primary care access is different in communities that qualify for additional provincial funding to recruit and retain doctors and nurse practitioners at the county level.

02:20:38 Speaker 12: Was there any conversation about how the success of that programme might look different in a place like Owen Sound that doesn't qualify for that additional funding in those programmes compared to Grey County as a

02:20:51 Speaker 12: whole,

02:20:52 Speaker 12: or was it really just at that county perspective?

02:20:55 Speaker 12: I guess what's in it for us is my question.

02:20:58 Speaker 11: The one response there I can provide was that infrastructure is a considerable impediment for building out attachment... for individuals and engravers?

02:21:09 Speaker 11: We didn't have any discussion about inconsistencies in terms of financial remuneration through the province in terms of benefiting some municipalities more so over others.

02:21:23 Speaker 11: Okay, so I'll call the question.

02:21:24 Speaker 09: On favour of receiving that, endorsing that: carried.

02:21:28 Speaker 09: Thanks.

02:21:30 Speaker 09: Next is consent agenda.

02:21:33 Speaker 09: Is there anything on that agenda...

02:21:33 Speaker 09: Is there anything that anyone wants to be pulled and dealt with separately, Councillor?

02:21:39 Speaker 09: As I was on motions, I did reach out to folks to ask if there was anything they'd like to be pulled.

02:21:43 Speaker 12: I had requests to pull items C, D, and E. I don't know if that covers everyone's bases...

02:21:49 Speaker 12: And that is the Integrity Commission Committee meeting calendar, the approval of the multi-year capital plan, and the outdoor public water stations reports.

02:21:59 Speaker 12: For those of you following along at home: did you have a separate one?

02:22:06 Speaker 12: So I will, through your Worship, just give an overview of what is listed on the consent agenda this evening.

02:22:23 Speaker 12: So there are reports respecting a potential land sale of part of Part Two, Plan 16R-8752; a request to remove a one-foot reserve at 1389 Sixteenth Ave East.

02:22:34 Speaker 04: Updates on the Integrity Commissioner and the 2027 Council and Committee Meeting Calendar.

02:22:40 Speaker 04: Approval of the 2027 to 2031 Multi-Year Capital Plan.

02:22:43 Speaker 04: Update on the transition to outdoor public water stations.

02:22:46 Speaker 04: Approval of non-standard procurement for the E-Scribe software and ice resurfacer.

02:22:51 Speaker 04: And a report on the continuation of Gulf Islands Sound Transit after August 31st.

02:22:56 Speaker 04: There are minutes for receipt from Grey Sauble Conservation Authority Board, Library Board, and the Police Board.

02:23:02 Speaker 04: There are several business licences issued: Prince Yahad Transit Solution at 127 Eight Street East; Red Swan Pizza at 925 Sixteenth Street East, Unit Two; Toppers Pizza at 1057 Second Ave East;

02:23:19 Speaker 04: Karsley's at 1356 Sixteenth Street East; Wacky Moose Barn Grill at 1315 Sixteenth Street East; Fresh Coat On Sound at 2125 Sixteenth Street East; Adele's Tailor Shop at 1035 Third Ave East;

02:23:31 Speaker 04: First Health Counseling at 890 Fourth Ave East; O'Shan Pickleball Club at 3225 East Bayshore Road Unit 6; Schmidt Plumbing Company at 1255 Fourth Ave West; Grey Bruce Transportation at 601 Seventh Street A East;

02:23:46 Speaker 04: Red Line Taxi at 650 Sixteenth Street East; The Admiral's Barber Shop at 975 Second Ave East; Intellcom Courier Canada at 1875 Sixth Ave East.

02:23:55 Speaker 04: One thousand, four hundred and seventy-five Sixth Ave East Unit Two and Province Electric at 1475 Second Ave East.

02:24:02 Speaker 04: A flag flying request was approved for Childcare Worker and Early Childhood Educator Appreciation Day, and an illumination request was approved for World Thrombosis Day.

02:24:11 Speaker 04: The last item on the consent agenda is the information package.

02:24:14 Speaker 04: A full listing is available online.

02:24:18 Speaker 04: Good?

02:24:18 Speaker 04: Thank you.

02:24:19 Speaker 04: So Councillor Farmer is going to move all except C, D, and E. That move by myself: that in consideration of the items listed on the July 27, 2026 consent agenda,

02:24:33 Speaker 04: that City Council receives items 11A to B and 11F to O; and approves the recommendations contained in items 11A to B and 11F to H. And all in favour?

02:24:48 Speaker 12: That's carried.

02:24:49 Speaker 09: Thanks.

02:24:50 Speaker 09: I will double back to 11C.

02:24:52 Speaker 09: So this is a quick question: I'm in agreement with sending individuals to the AMCTO conference, which impacts the previous schedule for the June meeting.

02:25:05 Speaker 11: Do we have the ability...

02:25:07 Speaker 11: We have had individuals, not named Brianna or Stacy, fill in on Monday nights here in the past.

02:25:15 Speaker 11: If they are both absent, do we have the ability to backfill and maintain the previous schedule?

02:25:21 Speaker 11: Or is it legislatively prohibited that we're not able to be absent?

02:25:27 Speaker 11: Both of them.

02:25:29 Speaker 11: Mr. Bloomfield, through your worship to Deputy Mayor Greig, thank you for the question.

02:25:35 Speaker 04: We can make accommodations should Council want to continue the meeting in our absence.

02:25:45 Speaker 04: I thank the clerks for putting it on the screen right now.

02:25:47 Speaker 11: I think the previous schedule is something that I preferred more so.

02:25:52 Speaker 11: I think tonight is just another example of at times you get massive agendas and it increases the workload.

02:26:00 Speaker 11: It locks it into one in June, two in July, and then the break.

02:26:05 Speaker 11: And I just see massive volumes before Council.

02:26:09 Speaker 11: I don't think it's...

02:26:10 Speaker 11: I understand where staff are coming from in altering it with the conference, but I think it is more beneficial to Council if we were to maintain the previous schedule of June 14th and June 28,

02:26:26 Speaker 11: keeping the two meetings in June as opposed to one.

02:26:29 Speaker 11: And I think tonight is a shining example of why you do that.

02:26:37 Speaker 11: Go ahead, through your worship; I suggest that Councillor make a motion to approve the calendar.

02:26:48 Speaker 04: Sorry, I had it written out here: bring forward a motion to direct staff to update the calendar as presented in the report, save and accept the regular Council meeting in June,

02:26:56 Speaker 04: and maintain two regular Council meetings in June.

02:27:00 Speaker 04: Okay, so moved.

02:27:03 Speaker 04: Any questions?

02:27:04 Speaker 04: Seeing none.

02:27:05 Speaker 09: Call the question.

02:27:06 Speaker 09: All in favour?

02:27:07 Speaker 09: That's carried.

02:27:10 Speaker 09: Eleven D...

02:27:12 Speaker 09: Is it yours?

02:27:14 Speaker 09: Ah, seeing the Mayor.

02:27:15 Speaker 09: Thank you.

02:27:15 Speaker 12: Yeah, eleven D and E were both me.

02:27:20 Speaker 12: Eleven D is the approval of the multi-year capital plan, and we had been expecting an update with a report about the fortress.

02:27:32 Speaker 12: So those not familiar with the term on in the 900 block of First Avenue West: there's a stone-looking structure that has multiple levels, and we were expecting a report back about that for this meeting.

02:27:46 Speaker 12: That report is not on the agenda, and I was just hoping for some more information from staff about why that is and what we can expect going forward.

02:27:59 Speaker 12: Thank you, Your Worship.

02:28:00 Speaker 19: I believe last week I had sent Council a note to let you know that the report on the fortress wouldn't be presented with the capital budget this evening.

02:28:08 Speaker 19: I haven't been able to secure costing for that work, and I didn't want to bring it before Council without having a good estimate of cost.

02:28:18 Speaker 19: So I hope to bring that at your next update in December.

02:28:23 Speaker 19: Thank you.

02:28:24 Speaker 12: A final question to Eleven D...

02:28:27 Speaker 12: And we might need J back up.

02:28:31 Speaker 12: But regarding Eleven E, which I've also pulled to speak to: is about the water fill station/water bottle fountain issue?

02:28:42 Speaker 12: Before we get to that point, make sure that I understand correctly that the capital item listed as Cap 27-0025 around general facilities, bottle fill stations... that's the same project/budget line that's been carried forward annually,

02:29:00 Speaker 12: that we'll be speaking to in Eleven E. If I can ask that question in English:

02:29:09 Speaker 12: just making sure there is a $10,000 that we see in the multi-year capital plan for water bottle and fountain refill stations, as part of its annual presence.

02:29:22 Speaker 12: Is that correct?

02:29:27 Speaker 12: It's not carry-forward funds; those were the funds that were budgeted for this year.

02:29:32 Speaker 12: I believe that's the answer to your question.

02:29:36 Speaker 12: Okay.

02:29:36 Speaker 12: Thank you.

02:29:36 Speaker 12: Then I would move the motion for the multi-year capital plan with that additional information: in consideration of staff report CR 26-074 respecting the approval of the 2027 to 2031 multi-year capital plan,

02:29:51 Speaker 12: that Council one approves the projects funded within the 2027 to 2031 multi-year capital plan,

02:29:57 Speaker 12: and two directs staff to bring forward a further update to the 2027 to 2031 multi-year capital plan for subsequent approval in December of 2026.

02:30:08 Speaker 12: Okay.

02:30:08 Speaker 12: Any questions?

02:30:11 Speaker 12: You're not... you're so used to asking questions; you're not going to ask yourself a question.

02:30:16 Speaker 09: I don't want to get between you and yourselves.

02:30:19 Speaker 09: I'll call the question.

02:30:20 Speaker 09: All in favour?

02:30:21 Speaker 09: That's carried.

02:30:23 Speaker 09: So that gets us through consent.

02:30:26 Speaker 09: No, the next Eleven E.

02:30:29 Speaker 09: Eleven E. Okay.

02:30:30 Speaker 09: I thought we just did that one.

02:30:31 Speaker 09: Sorry.

02:30:31 Speaker 09: Okay.

02:30:31 Speaker 09: Go ahead.

02:30:33 Speaker 09: Thank you.

02:30:34 Speaker 12: The nuance of calling four questions... months of calling four questions and calling the question apparently lost on me.

02:30:39 Speaker 12: So this report, Eleven E: We asked for that at a recent capital meeting.

02:30:44 Speaker 12: And for context so everyone's on the same page: we passed this motion in 2023, and every year or two, we've continued to see the $10,000 set aside for water bottle filling stations,

02:30:56 Speaker 12: and it's in the capital plan again with a project start date of January 1st, 2027.

02:31:03 Speaker 12: And in like considering that we have not moved the project forward since 2023, and that water fountains cost more than indoor bottle filling stations,

02:31:16 Speaker 12: I'm curious how much unspent budget is currently available for this project, or would the previous year's worth of $10,000 for a bottle fill station have just gone back into the regular pot?

02:31:28 Speaker 12: And we did because we didn't use it, so it's back in the regular pot of funding.

02:31:33 Speaker 12: We get another chance now in 2027 to allocate that funding.

02:31:40 Speaker 12: Through your worship, consistent with any other capital project, if it doesn't get spent or if it's under budget, the funds go back into the capital reserve.

02:31:48 Speaker 22: We don't continue to earmark them for their original purpose; so they would be redistributed in future multi-year capital plans.

02:31:56 Speaker 22: That said, we have been installing water filling stations consistently through a number of years.

02:32:02 Speaker 22: Just recently, we put one in the Farmers Market washroom.

02:32:05 Speaker 22: We've put one in Bayshore more recently.

02:32:08 Speaker 22: So those have been happening on a one-off ad hoc basis.

02:32:16 Speaker 22: Yeah, thank you.

02:32:16 Speaker 12: I appreciate that focus.

02:32:19 Speaker 12: The 2023 motion was specifically around dedicating that budget to publicly accessible outdoor multi-use water bottle fill and water fountain installations.

02:32:32 Speaker 12: Under the timing and scheduling section of the report, it says the transition schedule is determined by capital planning framework and the completion of site-specific assessments.

02:32:40 Speaker 12: Milestones are prioritized based on staff capacity, capital resource availability, and the strategic goal of enhancing public access in high-traffic areas.

02:32:48 Speaker 12: The project aligns with the city's annual work plan, and timelines are adjusted as needed to accommodate other organizational priorities, ensuring that the transition remains responsive to council's directives.

02:33:01 Speaker 12: And yet we haven't since 2023 seen an outdoor water fountain installed.

02:33:05 Speaker 12: So I'm wondering if staff could tell us whether there is currently a plan for when staff will begin to explore outdoor public water stations in response to the motion from three years ago?

02:33:17 Speaker 12: Acknowledging that we haven't spent the funding, so it's gone to other projects.

02:33:20 Speaker 12: We've got a chance again in 2027, and we know that outdoor water fountains cost more than just putting a unit in a wall.

02:33:29 Speaker 12: What's the actual plan and timeline?

02:33:33 Speaker 12: Through your worship, to Councillor Farmer: thank you for the question.

02:33:37 Speaker 23: So we do have a project for 2027.

02:33:43 Speaker 23: It is Cap-25, which is $10,000 to install a water station.

02:33:50 Speaker 23: At this point, that project is fully funded in our 2027 capital plan.

02:33:55 Speaker 23: Staff are currently completing site evaluations for potential locations.

02:34:01 Speaker 23: If council were to have recommendations for spaces that they could feel would be well warranted, we would be open to hearing that as well.

02:34:12 Speaker 23: Through the mayor: my concern is that this feels a lot like the motion that we made in 2023, and that type of unit that we discussed prioritizing has not been installed anywhere.

02:34:24 Speaker 12: So I'm...

02:34:27 Speaker 12: I'm going to move that we accept the report for information purposes,

02:34:30 Speaker 12: and then I'm going to move a subsequent motion that we specifically put in the work plan for 2027 an outdoor water fountain because it really appreciates the report and the information that came back making

02:34:40 Speaker 12: it clear that they cost more money to buy,

02:34:44 Speaker 12: and it's more complicated to install.

02:34:45 Speaker 12: There are winterization concerns obviously, and none of those things have been worked into the work plan.

02:34:55 Speaker 12: Acknowledging staff bandwidth issues—and that's why we have a capital projects coordinator now—but I'm just really confused about it not happening over a series of years.

02:35:05 Speaker 12: We haven't increased the amount; we haven't accrued the amount that would make this possible, and that's why I'll make a subsequent motion.

02:35:11 Speaker 12: But I guess I'll stop there and just move that we receive the report for information.

02:35:18 Speaker 12: Recommendation: Don't you dare?

02:35:20 Speaker 12: Recommendation is before I see...